Silesia Games - How to Become a Part of the Console Market and Not Go Crazy

[Music] thank you for coming first of all because uh my biggest fear was not that I will say something stupid but actually that the room will be empty so thanks a lot that not only my colleagues are here okay uh the topic is quite long and this this there's a lot of words in it but basically I will be talking from the experience of our company what we do every day how to move from PC or steam or epic like whatever you call it uh to the console world and how to do it smart and avoid some troubles sorry okay so who we are uh

that's a snapshot from our website I'm not going to focus about that too much we call celesia games we are a company based in the cesan region um and uh currently we have uh almost 15 20 per employees something like that uh we do uh Port games to consoles we are a partner of Playstation Xbox and switch of course and we also are on Steam so um a few things happened a few things happened last year we opened a new office in chesen uh we also increased the staff significantly um and uh we also celebrated our 10 years anniversary so we are 10 10 years in a business we are originally uh we uh developed a few games ourselves and now we are focusing on porting and Publishing games to consoles more yeah sorry more on our website if you want to visit so a few

words about myself uh that's me well that was me a few years back but that's my only good photo so I'm going to rock that one for a bit um what I do my S uh key role is the account management so basically I talk with uh the developers I'm trying to um explain what we do and I manage their everyday needs and then also guide through the whole process and and make sure that all the questions are answered and basically that's what this lecture is about we as a team put it all together because pretty much I hear all the same questions and um to make it simple for everybody I made this presentation out of it to answer them hopefully uh uh with in an interesting way but also but also I'm a I'm a gamer I'm an active PS5 gamer uh that's my console of choice so um I not only work

in the industry but I also enjoy it so I think that's quite important to to have a bit fun out of it okay so I made a few assumptions that you are here because you either already developed a steam game a PC game or you are in Early Access or you want to be or working on a PC project but you didn't move to the consoles yet so that that's my assumption hopefully it's it's right um so I thought about it what uh what skills what what um what key characteristics are needed for you to be on the PC already or working on a PC game well definitely you need to have some skills especially if you are a solo developer or within a small team you need to know how to program how to design of course do Graphics Etc or uh have contacts and resources to to hire a team that will make a music for you will'll make some

graphics and so on but also you need um a vision okay you need to you need to know what you want to do you need to have a plan you need to execute that plan you cannot stop in the middle because obviously then the game is not finished uh so you need to be resourceful you need to have dedication um all that stuff I think uh it's quite true and also time because uh more often than not I deal with people who uh Mak games uh part-time so so after hours in the evenings during weekends so it takes years instead of months usually uh so definitely a lot of time is needed so if you want to be here um because switch is still being perceived as the uh main console for indie games and that's what what we deal with mostly um you need to have a new sets of uh attributes or skills but ideally you also want to be

here and not true for all games because sometimes doesn't make sense to to port to every platform but usually yes because you never know you never know which platform will become the strongest for your game we have some experience we have some assumptions or um we make guesses let's say and then we can decide okay doesn't make sense to for example release on Playstation but in the end the market will decide so so uh you might consider reporting to to all three so what is needed uh to be a part of the console word if you only know the PC World well definitely new skills yeah the program is programming is a bit different the environment is different um the uh requirements are quite different I'm going to talk about that later on um more time for sure uh especially if you as I said work part-time that's another project you need to uh uh do for significant amount

of time unless you hire somebody then you need more resources uh you need a new hardware yeah because uh while working on a PC you um you probably already have a PC you have a laptop and that's often enough for consoles uh it's obviously not enough um dedication sure the same as before you need to go through but this time you need to consider a things like uh legal stuff like uh requirements from platforms which are different from every platform like filling out forms like um fa be faced with the failed certification I'm going to talk about that uh on the next slide uh and ideally it would be great if you had somebody who already done it or make a cooporation because it's like it's almost like you know building a house yourself uh you can do it of

course but doing it the first time you will you will have quite a lot of uh hurdles along the line so the path to the goal first do it yourself um that's I'm not going to talk too much about it uh of course doable especially if you have a a small like uh let's say logic game or or puzzle game then to release on switch um would be quite quite easy but again you need to become a partner of of switch which takes time and there are procedures and uh they need to have a hardware and so on and so on but doable second one is split the job so it might be uh for example that you do deporting maybe you have the dev kids already maybe you have somebody who have them you can you can I don't know borrow them or buy used ones and you are a skilled programmer so obviously you're going to you're going to program it yourself you're going to test it and then you only need somebody to publish

it okay so you are still a developer and you uh looking for a publisher the other way around um you do not want to waste time on porting uh investing in the in the new hardware and you hired a team for porting and in the meantime you you're trying to become a partner of Nintendo PlayStation Xbox and then you release it under your own name so two parts are possible and of course the third one you hire a team uh you just uh you know uh make a hopefully a good uh sign a good contract for you of course and um just expect results right uh and maybe in the meantime work on a new game because then you have spare time you you don't need to worry about the uh Port so before you make that choice if you happen to be in that place where you thinking about different paths to the goal you need to consider a few things first is the sorry I'm looking because

uh every time I press the button I don't know if I press it twice or once it's very sensitive and first uh the hardware I already mentioned that that's an estimate three and a half thousand Euro uh it might be wrong uh we bought our ours uh a few uh years back and then we bought a new version but uh more or less it's it's somewhere along that number and that is one set yeah if you want to have every version for Playstation so old generation New Generation uh Xbox then you want to have a switch one this is pretty much the cost you need to invest and for some it will be not significant at all it's not a very very big number but if you're SOL de working part parttime that might be uh a problem initially because you need to invest now this is the most uh time consuming I'd say part of the slide okay I cannot see the light doesn't matter

technical requirements there are a lot of check boxes that you need to have checked before the game is certified there are there are a lot of rules and uh like a small fine print in the in the um contracts with the platforms uh that you need to consider uh releasing game on Steam you have a great um great procedure when you can have Early Access the game doesn't have to be finished you can work on it in the meantime you can have feedback from the players and then fix bugs etc etc with consoles the game pretty much needs to be finished and uh working and do not have bugs that uh are game breaking uh it's very difficult to release a game that doesn't work on consoles it's quite easy to do it on Steam so um things like memory

allocation things like handling controls in a way that each platform does it differently um even uh the small things like having uh having the different translations uh implemented yes so it displaced at the right let's say Japanese or or Chinese it is all really checked okay you can have your game perfectly looking working to the last level and then the certification is failed because you know some OD language is is is not displayed correctly uh and also the rejection is quite um it's quite cost if I can use that word um it's better not to fail too many times because then you as a partner is not being seen as a professional let's say uh so you really need to have that in mind that the first or second certification would be should be the success ful ones of course we have

different projects on on some we had more rejections on some was on a first try but you basically learn along the lines so so if you if this is Project number 10 or 12 or or 15 then you obviously need what to pay attention to that that's that sounds not obvious but it's really a key part of the process here also the uh SDK the platform changes uh maybe not very often but quite often uh I asked today earlier when I Was preparing last bit of bits of information before this presentation uh which how how often the CH the versions changed uh during our our experience and I found out that when we started uh with switch five or so years ago uh there was version six of SDK and now it's 18 and why is that important if you happen to be very slow with your development of the project and in the

meantime the version changes you cannot uh Supply that version for certification you need to do the updates so you need to go back to the projects and maybe change even the first lines in your in your code um again not very obvious but something you have to have in mind now I don't know I don't know about you but I do not like feeling forms and there's a there's quite a lot of them when it comes to uh platform forms and again each platform handles it differently so uh the whole certification process again is paperwork if you happen to have English language as your not as your main language then maybe you need to update on your legal terms a bit because uh even becoming a partner it's it's it's a procedure you need you need to go through also there are rules when it comes to store and when when it comes to trailers and that's uh really important to us especially because we believe that

store and trailer are the most important marketing bits that are out there for Indie gam especially um and they need to look perfect and be uh as good as possible and they also pay attention to it so for example um if you release on Steam it's pretty much like Facebook whatever you put there goes maybe if it's offensive okay then then you have some uh rejection but you you design the content and you you can have it short you can have it long the graphics are up to you the wording is up to you uh when it comes to console there's a specific format you need to you need to consider you need to follow uh all the graphics all the translations uh I think for PlayStation is like 50 languages you have to have supported for every game okay so it also has it probably should be a good quality translation so no Google translate um and these are the things that you need to again follow

okay it's not like free for all you need to stick to the rules for trailers uh interesting I have a a two stories for you one um ah one thing to to say first we do most of the time liveaction trailers so we um hire actors we work with kids we work with adults uh we film um like living rooms and sometimes in the field and especially for switch we show a console that you can take it anywhere basically in the park um in the forest for example and and play the game so we had a few rejections of art trailers not because it was offensive or it was looking bad or or was too long but one time we were filming on the train station and the two kids were holding a switch console and they were stuning on the platforms there was no train it was during the the the low time it was nice sunny weather and we filmed that we put it into uh the the

Montage and the trailer was looking very nice but Nintendo said okay sorry guys we cannot accept that because those kids are standing too close to the trucks okay so they paid really attention to stuff like security like um like General they really watch it it's not like they they accept they accept it right away so unfortunately we wanted that scene uh badly in our trailer we need to go back to the location wait for the sunny weather film it again and really pay attention that to show that their feet are behind the line yeah uh other one is uh even even funnier um again Nintendo we were filming a trailer to I think hidden objects game and basically uh we were showing a person calling uh yes because in the game there's a scene where where you like accept jobs and there's a phone icon there so we thought

we're going to show somebody talking on the mobile we didn't show the logo we didn't show the actual phone it was just the person holding a black object near the ear Nintendo said we cannot show phones we have to reject it they didn't go into specifics but we believe the reason is that if we show the trailer the only digital device should be their console so something that never you know had we had that in mind we never thought about it so again that caused us some troubles we need to reso uh but why I'm saying about this There Are Rules it's not it's not like Facebook where you basically do what you want this this pretty much like we all we all know that and it's um it's a slogan but I really do believe that because um sometimes I hear people this is not from gaming IND industry but some

somebody my family for example brags that he's so proud that for example he did the whole house renovation on his own okay I'm not talking about paintings but I'm talking about tiling for example so put the tiles in in the floor on in or in the walls in the bathroom and I said okay great so you saved some money okay but how long did you do it well a month between the jobs and then my we had to use another bathroom and it was confusing and crazy for a month so you know sometimes what is worth considering uh just pain for for a job and do not worry about that too much and uh that's pretty much what it is with the with the console U porting because it's a it's another job that maybe you're going to find somebody who who does it better and you have a free mind to do other stuff so this is basically what I do I uh I usually first contact with uh a

solo teams or or solo teams solo developers or a small uh Dev Studios uh bigger with with every project um so I approached them or I'm approached by uh them and we talked about uh how to do this what's the first step um how to move forward uh um where the start and the most important factor is is a single one does anybody body have any idea what that word will be next what's the most important factor between developer publisher okay that's that's good one anybody huh yes exactly um because consider this you have a guy who spends years on his project so that's pretty much like his baby right he he cares about every detail he cares about every line of code and then he basically needs to um share

that code with people he never met because we for example deal with people on five continents and most of them we never met uh we sometimes have uh video calls but usually the start is email so we need to somehow generate this trust and and show that we are not just some new company you know this being 10 years in in in the industry helps so um what we do is we publish all the info from our old Partners Uh current Partners uh so you can always say you can just contact them directly ask about us check how how we are in this relationship uh read about us online you know we are proud to say we never had any issues there's no red deit uh threat saying okay celesia games is this and that uh we usually try to to to to go in dep's way so so he's happy um and we also have

some testimonials as well I'm going to read them but that kind of helps and that's that's my everyday uh job so that was like an introduction I will show you now one of our uh projects one specific game and I'm going to guide you through the whole uh process from the start to the end how basically it it looks with uh with any game so the game is hammerhelm it's a nice mix of RPG action and some management I'll show that later in in the details and that's the whole road so from the first Contact through NDA through negotiation and then we have of course porting marketing and the release and the support um I'm going to try to to cover that all so what is Hammer ham it's a mixture of action as you can see we have a dwarf fighting there but not only that we have a time uh town management we have a

crafting we have crops so so resource management of course quests NPCs and so on and the whole game is 3D and that was our most advanced project up to date back then so uh we um decided to move from from simple games to this one and was really really challenging project I will tell you why in a bit so what was hammerhand back then it was solo developed 3 years till early access and then another four years so quite quite a long time uh but as you can imagine a single guy a lot of cod um I think he had some help like with small graphical uh projects uh within the game but 90 something per was done by one person only which is quite impressive you ask me um on on Steam later on Epic price was $15 and then

um I cannot say too much because of ndas of course but let's call it unclear the situation with the current developer was just that he had sorry publisher he had a publisher he had an agreement uh this publisher released the game on Steam but then kind of stopped and that's where we moved in and we released on on all consoles but unfortunately uh the publisher started the process with Xbox he didn't touch PlayStation or switch but on Xbox it was like in the middle so we need to uh kind of rewind the whole process and I was involved with that and and there was a lot of uh emails let's say it to to to get that straight but the last part is the more important one this guy the main Drive was that he had a desire to reach more players because he spent so much time and effort on this game that he was not happy to have it only on

PC he wanted to have it globally on all consoles so um that the code that the actual product can reach uh the most players that that's possible and we really like that we are kind of like that ourselves uh within a year we release quite a lot of games we have different projects going on H but we are very happy when we increasing the whole Downs number because pretty soon this year uh we're going to reach a million right so so if I think about it I'm coming from town that 40,000 um people live in so it it it impresses me it makes an impression on me and that's that's the goal to make it even more popular so um so that's that's the guy we started with the NDA of course and that was actually a mutual NDA so we are covering his assets but also ours we have a pro procedures that

not necessarily want to share with everybody and also it's a document that shows that he willingly gave us his code which is also important but of course the main thing is protection of the developer uh that we cannot use the code or sell the code um other than uh specified in the agreement and a word of advice if you talking with uh different Publishers and this doesn't come up first from their side I would I would have a red lamp Okay if you if they just say okay send us the code uh then I would reconsider uh to be honest um so we signed the deal we signed the the agreement then we looked at the code and that was in unity and as you can imagine a lot of code a lot of code for the 3D games so many different generals mixed and uh we did spend about a week or two because that's usually what we do on checking the code but we do check it not looking for bugs

necessarily we're looking for plugins because there's usually not just the main Unity uh stuff core but there are some also some external plugins and that's really important because sometimes there are plugins um that are supported by steam but there are no versions for consoles and we need to know that beforehand uh there is way around way around it because you can some sometimes replace plugins or even you know we have coders right so they can they can find a way but it's better to know that in advance not in the middle of the of the process unfortunately from the perspective we we discovered that this particular project we should spend probably like a month checking it because um there were a lot of uh issues that came up later on uh that we that kind of surprises us surpris surprised us but uh nowadays we would spend definitely more time because we have

bigger stuff as well uh but you know that's life you you have a new project this was this was a really Advanced one for us so um so we had to deal with it so now the funny part uh terms and conditions um thankfully the the situation on switch and Playstation was clear so we could just put it in contract and almost immediately start working on it uh because there was no uh no process started from the old publisher uh what we usually do is we uh work on a commission uh so on we only get paid after the game is released and uh and it earns uh and we make sure that def gets the bigger chunk because that that's his baby and uh so we invest our development process our porting process is the is the investment for us we take risks as well because not all games uh make profits exceeding our costing a reporting cost um and the developer uh

gets gets the uh the part of the of the profit uh by not doing the the the porting uh part so in the meantime we were sorting the Xbox and I mentioned that already that I was involved and basically I if I remember right uh only after reaching the third Department we we managed to sort this out because I was con constantly uh redirected between people and uh funny enough uh like with Microsoft there's a corporation that's a corporation so you never reach the actual guy so so you write an email to a general email and you get many answers from different people so when when I managed to to reach the person that really wanted to help us I I addressed him by his name and I think he saw that and he was kind of dealing with our case and that helped um so this process alone took a few months I'm I'm not exaggerating this um in the end it

came down to even if everything else is done digitally in the end this old publisher need to print a piece of paper signed it scan it send it to the Xbox we had to do the same and that helped okay so that really surprised me that Microsoft wanted that as the as the solution to the problem but anyway we managed it we said that uh we said time frame uh we wanted to start at the late January of 2002 uh and we started with uh switch I believe so this slide I apologize there be a lot of text uh oh by the way uh the whole presentation can be um downloaded if you contact me I can send you a PDF so or no uh photos or or uh notes necessary uh if you want this was a lot of uh preparation to do that slide and that's uh kind of pce

treated as an estimate because it's not as easy as okay we finished that version then we stopped and then we uh started on on Playstation then Xbox it kind of mixed it was it was flu fluctu so uh we aimed at 6 months till release but it turned out that was actually 18 a lot of a lot of uh troubles to solve really along the line and not only from our side because when I talked about checking the code we would take longer uh now um it turned out that during the porting process we discovered gamebreaking buxs that were in the original code that not even developer or the players from Steam found it before so we need to go back to the dev he needed to fix it uh send us the patch we need to Port the patch and it was difficult also from the perspective of

how long the code is because he was often referred referring to the specific code line but his code line didn't match our code line because our code was already ported so so we need to develop a process how to how to call it by procedures and and uh point exactly where we should have update and and so we did um so there are few steps here like testing like uh certification phase which I already explained uh digital St store content but the highlights of the word trailer is not is not um by accident uh we believe that is the most single most important um asset when it comes to promoting the game obviously we still do contact reviewers uh YouTubers we do social media post Etc ET YouTube but the actual trailer on the store Page if it's Nintendo or Playstation or Xbox We

Believe gets more the most results uh that are possible um that's why we put very much focus on it and I'm going to show you the trailer for this for this game it's only one minute long so please bear with me uh I think you might like it without a stronghold and a clan what's the worth of a dwarf I think I found that out I dared to dream about life on the surface and for that they wanted to banish me to Exile so I exiled myself at first I was alone but then with my hard work are the soon F over time we've built ourselves

an impressive place I was an exile now I'm a local hero and my hard work just never [Music] ends okay I didn't take part in filming of this unfortunately I have some other projects that I took part but uh working with actors working with uh uh my colleague here Adam filmmaker H it's really exciting it's it's like the next level to my job and really every project is different so that's like a benefit to me as well um so uh I I believe this trailer for sure helped us sold uh a lot of copies let's let's call it that we cannot tell exact

because we we didn't release uh the game without the trailer so we don't know we cannot go back but uh I believe that that help us and and that's exactly where it should be displayed okay a person who goes to the store Page who um who wants to make a decision if this game is for him or not or for her uh he pretty much always show Clicks on the trailer of course pictures as well well photos and Snapchats but but I believe this trailer sells so the release time and as I said we released on three platforms and we wanted to synchronize it because then the impact of the marketing is the biggest we believe the date is one day apart uh and why Xbox always want to go first so basically that's like a requirement from them we always take a one day apart uh it's not big deal uh we do it so so they are happy and uh it's still the impact

of the of the social media marketing and and trailer is is still there so we released on all five platforms uh old generation current generation and then uh switch we kept the price from team and that was a mistake it could be lower I'll will tell you later and then of course we offered after relased uh support because and once the player base uh expanded uh after releasing it turned out there's still a few bucks were found in the game so we uh of course helped to fix them and uh make the game better so hammer hammerel now obviously released on five different platforms um and now we have a cooporation with with Super 6 but that was quite interesting the um I cannot show you the exact numbers of downloads of course but uh uh

to see that PlayStation outplayed other other consoles other platforms so much was quite a surprise for us um we suspected that PlayStation will have the biggest Chunk in the pie uh because pretty much the games that shows fighting they are perceived a bit more hardcore not only for for kids and sells more on Playstation Xbox in our experience is more relaxed platform like we have a lot of uh indie games uh based on a hidden object uh genre with cats so this is like a hit on Xbox so so we we really see that uh differentiation um on switch we suspect that it will be the lowest because probably the screen size a lot of menus it's pretty much more comfortable playing on a big screen but this ratio we would never suspect and what's more

interesting uh from PlayStation more copies sold on PS5 than PS4 which is really counterintuitive because there are more for PS4 platforms out there and actually our game doesn't run that much better on PS5 it's not a surprise it's like you can only see the uh the difference in in the big AAA games let's say less loading time Etc here very similar similar looking looking versions and still PS5 had more downloads so that's what I said it's not not with all but with most projects is really better to consider reporting to to all consoles so our partner now what happened to Jonathan in the meantime he released a new game called pirate dragons as you can imagine it's about Pirates and dragons and that was in March I asked him about the game and uh I'm going to read that that's probably too small for

you back there and he said a very nice very cool thing the game was more of a labor of love and it hasn't sold well but I'm fine with that I just wanted to make a game with Dragons so that's the kind of G that's the kind of guy he is um he has first of all he has a a desire to reach players he had an idea he wanted to make it he made it and that was his main Drive probably his main job pays well enough for him not to worry about money as somebody said there in the back earlier um and that's cool that that's really nice and I really hope uh he has a success with the game because the reviews not so many of them so so far but the reviews are are good and also he had some nice words about us I'm not going I'm not going to read that but his testimonials is is also on the on the on our website so he's happy with

the results he got uh we are happy uh that we we managed to uh to release the game which was really challenging as I said uh on different uh factors so a few things to uh remember um okay uh because um it's not for you like okay things you have to remember from this lecture it's really more for us because we obviously learned from this project quite a lot first each project can be challenging even if you made 60 or now more than 70 of them uh the biggest challenges in this one were the vast amount of code uh because as I said it was quite difficult to even uh predict the troubles we will run into when it comes to testing when it comes to modification of the code when it comes to BU f in uh and we just need to deal with it along

you know along the the process um for other games the challenges unfortunately can be that the game is just not good enough okay we think it looks cute it sold okay on Steam but for example uh on switch uh the crowd is more uh what's the word more expecting better results uh and um just doesn't sell well okay uh that that happens as well uh other CH challenges can be uh like it's it's so um difficult to market for example because it's so Niche maybe on Steam there are more passionate players of that Niche not so much on on consoles so um now we're trying to be very very strict let's call it uh when it comes to choosing the right project because we do not want to uh fail down the developer of course uh we don't want

to make games just to s for the sake of making it we did that 70 uh plus times we we we have a lot of games in our portfolio we also would like to work on more and more advanced projects every time so so we are more selective now uh when it comes to projects but still a very simple games if they just look nice and are well made and the code is wrote in a in nice matter and everything is clear and the contact of course with the developer is also good because if the contact starts with okay how much will you pay me uh I have this and this requirements you should do it this way you should sign a additional agreement with me is not a good start let's just call it okay um okay so agreement is one thing of course we should we should honor it as much much as we can but being flexible is also the

key uh we could have many moments where we could say okay let's not move forward because the game should be finished and it's full of bugs and we losing time on it and resources and let's let's let's uh finish it also the developer could say well guys you promised six months and now it's a year and the game is not released but this project was so challenging that we we had an understanding that uh okay that's what we predicted but actually more time is needed and uh each side was okay with it and we wanted to take it to the finish line and we did and I'm so happy with it so uh important thing to to remember I also already mentioned the price issue um probably because we spent so much time on it and developer also spent many many years on the project uh we wanted to have as much return uh as

possible on the on the downloads so that we kept the price $15 from the steam but that was a mistake and we probably would uh sell more when the price was below 10 uh because especially on switch there are like this um limits so uh you can set under games under $5 under 10 Etc and we believe this game should be priced around maybe $9 but uh that was a discovery we made later on so so that was a bit of overlooking on our part um so so that's one of uh advice I can I can give you also uh there are few few examples from our experience when was the other way around Dev wanted to sell as many copies have many many downloads on Steam that he said the price very very low and from our experience it doesn't make sense to set

the price below $3 so $3 is pretty much the starting uh price for us and and sometimes if it's lower then we we're going to increase it to three so it doesn't have to match already mentioned that it's nearly impossible to predict which console will perform best uh that's why where makes sense when the game looks nice for each platform it's better to spend a bit more time but release it on all three and uh that's why the uh the resources for for porting and and um and releasing are quite significant if you want to do it yourself and let's not forget about this one okay we we're making games so let's have some fun about it let's uh let's be positive about it it's not like it's not like uh end of the word especially if you if you do it as a site project okay if this is your your main source of income then it's a different story but

uh look around as everybody is relax here I think I'm the only guy with the button here tied so because I have a lecture but it's very easy to talk to guys from Activision from techland and and start a Rel relationship and and you meet some people so um we really are privileged it's not like we are working in banking with everything is like very very strict so thank you very much that's pretty much it uh just just one one second okay sorry I should probably not interrupt you when you're clapping me but uh one one more word uh if you want to scan this it's like a mail to link to me so there's a contact for myself I can show send you the free pdf version of the presentation if you want or we can just make contact uh this way and yeah thank you for for your attention [Applause]

thank you Chris also the presentation will be available on YouTube uh after the conference so you can rewatch the presentation and are there any questions oh do I just speak up yes so understand this correctly developers approach you uh and then you take over the the publishing for the conso so you invest your resources to make the Bo and you publish it to the to the bar C right so what I wanted to share ask is what is like the common uh Revenue share model like how do you split the revenues with the developers like do you split it by percentage from the very first sale or the consoles or do or do they first have to pay off like your investment and from then on you split by percent what's the most common models for this literally is the first question everybody asks but thank you for that why didn't you put it

in the so you can ask it no no seriously um the percentage wise it's quite difficult to to say like if I say it's usually this then everybody will start from this number but it really depends on the project on the complexity of the project uh it's not 10 not 20 okay it's not 50 let's call it in this region okay but I think that the second part of your question was more interesting uh which was uh about the cost reimbursement yeah uh we do not do that uh as I said we treat it as an investment so there's no cost for developer at all with one small asteris when it comes to translations uh we believe the game should be translated to uh to languages that we want to release in okay if we decided you want you want to have a we have we want to have it released in French Spanish and I don't

know Korean then the translation files should come from the developer it's we talking about few hundreds Euros basically if you use professional company H other than that no cost from the very first month of sales we split of course the console takes 30% and the remaining 70 we split according to the contract you said about the problems about switch boarding what about the POR for son and Microsoft is not a b or Flawless which part do you refer to uh which troubles oh okay okay yes yes yes um certification part is again again a lot of checkboxes you need to check in that's true for all consoles and also they are different so so the uh

fre frequency of SDK changes for PlayStation will be different than for Nintendo the forms would look different the way you can do it will be also different some require email some on Playstation need to everything you have a ticket for it so you need to register like on a forum and do it this way which is I believe slower uh but when it comes to trailers uh it's also interesting because okay that might be not true this moment because we actually want to reinvestigate that but a year or two ago we approached Sony and play and Microsoft to release liveaction trailers as well on their platforms and basically son just rejected us and uh Microsoft said that they prefer not to okay we didn't understand why they they they prefer just to have trailers with action of the game maybe not to confuse players what is game what is not which I think is is

quite dump because it's obvious but also those one specific feedback that they did not want to show uh people playing Xbox controllers and I really I have no idea why so we want to reinvestigate that because we have a lot of trailers that we can show them to and say look this is that's how we do it maybe maybe they suspected us to do it like in a very a mature way or I don't know I think this looks quite professional so maybe we we'll try to convince them because obviously the big names in the industry they do release those trailers maybe they treat just Indie people that like that it's a building relationship and that's also what we do so so we'll approach this this uh topic again and hopefully we'll we'll go past it you can say in which publish processing and cation is e okay if we talk about time consuming it's pretty much the same okay

um okay for us if you ask me that question uh two years ago I would say switch is the easiest because we uh we made 70 over 70 project on switch and we made like something like 1020 on on PlayStation and Xbox so we still gaining experience right uh but not that much different time consuming I'd say I think we have time for only the last question okay uh so thank you uh it's always lovely to hear someone with experience from the life uh environment from the industry uh I have a I hope a pretty complex question I don't I hope it will not take much time is that uh in the end while working industry you want to have benefits who want to gain money from the products we are releasing uh did you have any situation scenarios that after Consulting with a developer

with a partner uh you suggested that in some cases developing a console version not entire and not every possible console but for a specific console it's not good for the project of course yes that's what I said about being more uh selective and strict now in the in the very beginning of course we wanted to to make a name out for ourselves we have accepted a lot of projects some of them uh on some of them we lost money basically our our cost of development never got uh we got back but that's I think part of the process part of the learning uh but now I think we are at the stage um in our development when when we can pretty much say which game should work on which platform I mentioned that a bit already that more casual on Xbox more hardcore on PlayStation switch and acute games kind of like work

best uh and also not a lot of interface Soo because of the screen is small um but we need to play the game okay that's that's actually the first step so we we always ask about the codes for the keys for Steam for example we play it we look at the code and then we can decide um usually we advise for switch at least okay if we believe that the game is not fit for switch we don't really consider other platforms because switch is like like our main one at the moment for example for for in the game it could be the other way around if the game is a lot of 3D then we can say oh it's going to be very hard uh to optimize it for switch and then doesn't make sense spend much time on it because again the screen is so small and uh of course you can put it on with the TV connect but we we always show that it's mobile that you can take it anywhere so um we do have some guidelines it's it's

very hard to answer your your question specifically but we based on our experience we can guide uh the developer towards the the right console yeah thank you thank you thank you very much for coming was a pleasure