4X (R)evolution part1. Top Heroes: Idle RPG or 4X strategy game? (#99)

before you see all of this there's a very important important and this is this is the part yeah this is the part where stuff like soldiers and hospitals get introduced right after this big button in the top bottom of corner which says World awfully familiar it's like where do we see like hospitals and all these buildings for different resources and world map this is no [ __ ] game podast two and a half Gam sharing actionable insights dropping Knowledge from our day-to-day user acquisition game design and AD monetization jobs we are definitely not discussing the latest industry news but having so much fun let's not forget this is a 400 a.m. conference discussion Vibe so let's not take it too seriously have pressing issues let's go pressing issues I'll mention this I'll mention this for sure whatever you want I guess it's fine uh I I I do have some announcements uh

yeah let's do let's start let's start let's start okay welcome everyone my name is Matel anich I'm Felix Brer and I'm yier and we are your hosts we also work as consultants but you know that's not very important because of course it's important of course it's important but it's a discussion for another day uh I have a quick uh announcement for for the start which is really f fting to me because I was digging into our YouTube channel analytics and it says 55% of you guys our fans watch this channel frequently without having hit the Subscribe button and we just wanted to ask you a favor it really helps this channel so much if you actually hit the subscribe so you know it helps with our guests and oh my God what an amazing guests we had in the past few weeks thank you very much by way for coming it

helps also scale the production and it kind of you know it makes our no [ __ ] gaming show getting bigger and bigger so if we can ask one tiny thing and if you watched our show before and if you liked it and enjoyed it please hit that subscribe button and support us I'll even support it one level further and go so far to say that after last week's episode where I used the word add Revenue Juggernaut I promise not to use Juggernaut again for one year after ma threatened to kill me well it wasn't meeven bismar now instead but yeah enough of the chilling [ __ ] it's not chilling [ __ ] we're just you know thank you very much guys and we will make sure to return the favor and make the show better and better and also please comment and subscribe and just like the [ __ ] um episode because then my my email no my mother will appreciate that as well obviously but

there's you know like YouTube growth experts are sending me emails like how lame our show is and like how we are not doing a good job because the engagement is not there and the views are really low I was like man like [ __ ] like we are growing like crazy I'm not sure like how bigger this should be or better it should be but I I'm seeing like a lot of these in my inbox so please um comment like share subscribe just thank you Mr Beast for feedback yeah so what what do we what are we talking about today because what we're talking about today is a ad Revenue Lifeboat no tiny little skiff tin no no no no no no we are first we also this is going to go live Monday so see you all next well on Wednesday in Istanbul and two and a half Gamers uh mobile unpacked Mobile gaming unpacked um event I'm bringing some some cool [ __ ] with me hopefully uh also thank you very much guys for joining our slag is already 1,000 amazing people so

he he good to you it's completely open feel free to join it's in every link of the video podcast or yes or the Linkin posts you can find just adhere to Ma's rules and you won't get kicked out exactly yeah you just need to follow the rules and it's fine uh if you don't Sara all right all right so yeah enough enough of of the [ __ ] nobody cares uh what are we talking about oh we're talking about top heroes yes we're talking about Heroes and um yeah again as usual this will be a special because it won't be all of it because we will be doing a part one of the Forex Revolution series because and why I'm using the word Forex you will see in few moments as we get to it but because of the current changes in the market and some uh wildly scaling games such as top heroes what do you mean mobile gam gaming industry is dead

yeah so um we need to do a little bit of a special episode here because one thing is that games that we cover are like explosively growing but the other thing that we see a change on the Paradigm which we will talk a little bit more today but uh yeah more teasers or how the second part will be done this is actually's excited voice so don't worry yeah yeah don't worry yeah this is my excited voice because I slept like 3 hours I so much work and nobody cares we have so children and I sleep uh not that great as well top heroes the game that a lot of people are currently talking about uh what do you mean lot of people there's like three of them in the industry two are absolutely wrong they think there's like action RPG and they don't see below the surface but okay fine the thing is that uh the game you probably seen the creatives looks pretty casual and uh before we start the usual Deep dive let's look at the numbers per say by our friends from sensor Tower um

so looking at the revenue and this is really important the game was released January 16th yeah so it's very very new it's not something like really like was sitting there for some time and it immediately scaled to something like 300K I a day I a day and it is new so we would expect at least like half a meal a day already because of the sadness multiplayer yeah for sure and then downloads even though they are not growing explo explosively are still kind of growing or let's say on a grow Trend with something like 50k downloads a day which is a lot of downloads for this type of a game yes a very lot of downloads yes that's very important to say it's currently uh yeah both Google and iOS by green mushroom let's just leave it like there we just leave it there yeah okay yeah and then uh yeah let's go to the games experience

itself um so you start the game as as you have there uh as an RPG or let's say rather action RPG idle RPG or you can you can yeah you can yeah you can go here yeah you literally start here in this kind of a village disregard the screens that you see here because you won't see them yeah yeah just go somewhere in the forest yes yeah we need to go to the forest anyway this is how the game starts so like these are regard what you saw we just get there and explain along the way so the game starts like this when you literally have like a twin controller resembling something like Survivor iio or R chero which some kind of action based RPG isometric View and then you are pretty much going around you have these very easy literally like World of Warcraft mmrpg Quest like Kill 30 of this Kill 30 of that go there just go there super super easy super easy super like U yeah linear nothing's really to it your characters

can Farm These whatever trees or rocks or wood which is absolutely they are IR relevant let's say at the beginning lat definitely not um if we go to the map and move somewhere else actually where I pretty much where my progress ends currently yeah it's like there somewhere there uh you have these segments of the map that are unlocked slowly as you progress uh based on these quests and each each kind of from time to time there comes a section where you need to you know there's a chest and see see the see the thing here this is what I'm talking about so I have 1 million and 1 100,000 foot and to open this chest of soldiers it cost 40 so this is the thing of it that the game kind of in the beginning it makes sense later down it doesn't even make sense in the beginning you see you have 3,000 uh uh meat or whatever food and then you

open this um for 10 yeah it just doesn't make sense anymore but nobody cares literally nobody well the thing is nobody cares uh who is a player is a normal player right if you are a game developer and you know then you know yeah and you immediately like kind of understand oh [ __ ] this is this is completely different game yeah but if you're a normal player you you just nice action RPG let me install that and play that yeah is a great you know I kind of have Heroes you go along this map way where there are these portals which act as checkpoints there we have these kind of a sideway tangent passages the bosses uh if let's say I would need to move further into the fog here I would need to kind of collect the L me or whatever you even have the counter here and then if you go there you unlock it the game uh snaps a little bit and then this is the next passage I have the qu monsters right there and I kill them and move on

so on so forth you do this all the time there's hello there's a little bit of Boss here uh I kill that and continue and then you should stop killing those monsters I don't think your son likes it uh yeah I guess he won't won't see it anyway uh so this is how it goes and it goes and it goes and at some point on this Saga Journey that you're going here it tells you okay uh I think it's in the like you need to go back to the Village or something but let's go now to the town not the village so you go back to the town and suddenly the end of the forest actually yeah you can you can you can Port yeah it's at the end of the first end of the forest yeah that's where suddenly you are dropped into this nice little town near the forest like here was the forest and you can walk there immediately well wait wait a second like you're building this town from the The Village from the from the Geto yeah which is just not that obvious yeah yeah it's not that obvious but it's like same same kind of a trick yeah yeah

suddenly you can you can explore this like one building another building this this is the fog like they want to keep the illusion that it's part of that map yeah and then suddenly uh the city grows and grows and grows and you have these you know familiar buildings like the resource collectors here like the wood stuff the iron stuff or Rock stuff the crystal stuff yeah whatever and then uh of course your main building which is the like main gating mechanic of these games and then uh suddenly of course there's a gacha mechanics you can go and summon new Heroes why not because of course we have Heroes that's to be expected then there Comes The Saga mechanic because this is of course AFK Arena game so we also on a saga we're defeating challenges levels you have those secret realm things there you have even the asynchron PVP mechanic at some

point with different players their teams like it's like looks completely like AFK Arena or some kind of other Squad Bas but wait wait wait you are kind of like fast forwarding because before you see all of this there's a very important import yeah and this is the this is the part yeah this is the part where stuff like soldiers and hospitals get introduced right after this big button in the top bottom of corner which says world awfully familiar it's like where do we see like hospitals and all these buildings for different resources and the world map yes and we're back here as we are as usual I'm a Forex now yes and I was like [ __ ] hell like after the forest like I was like okay well you know uh you should you should send your Heroes to to here it's like wait wait a second you click on the world map I was like [ __ ] hell like all I we here again like is a Forex of

course it a Forex of course it is a Forex on steroids actually because it's and it's it's not just your usual like you know Cloak and Dagger hidden trick here that like we get rid of everything with did it's actually connected quite nicely um the thing is that the world button is definitely there which is the new mechanic that even guys from Century games are using to streamline the Forex flow because old Forex games they would usually um like let's say the base gam playay on the map would be you are attacking monsters or harvesting resources so you would go here through this kind of a map button and you would literally yourself search it so if I want an enemies I go here I search it and it kind of helps me because I don't need to go there manually but I can still go like if I want I can just you know like check it here and like go there myself okay this guy I'm going to attack here I can do that but this is just a helper mechanic there's the resource Gathering and there's the rail gathering for bosses let's see if I'm Still Still

Alive most probably I'm not check where I think you're still alive but probably just kind of corpse somewhere there de uh but what the world quest does it literally gives you very easy to do objectives and in streamlines this game playay so even if you're not the Forex player it's just easy because you just click on click on buttons so let's say that's how you int how you're introduced into the Forex like this world quest and like okay well you go here then you send the troops and they they come back oh well that's that's great Quest done yeah exactly that's it then again next Quest this is a battle one so we got there again the mechanic is just streamlining your kind of objectives on the map so you don't need to search them you press the button you send your squad there 25 seconds bum yeah it's it's in the usual March que they're you know going their way from your HQ as usual they will go you can see them on the map literally the same thing as you would see in something like game of war rise of Kingdoms whatever AR not shortle what was it mobile strike the usual mechanic so this is the like

the new generation of Forex games that are streamlining the Forex game play for non Forex players and adding them to the me grinder let's let's call it like that because that's how this game works and I'll explain exactly uh the other important thing uh where pretty much which helps you to immediately know why I rep playing Forex is as I said the hospital Soldier mechanic because this is like one of the Staples me of Forex game where you have your soldiers that get injured and you need to then heal them in the hospital and if you go more wounded soldier over your Hospital Camp and you don't have a place to put them they die so you lose them forever which is the destruction of permanent value that's why these games have infinite spand dep economies that's signature move that they have there the other thing is that you have your inventory which [ __ ] ton of stuff this just just how these games work because they have time as a currency so literally if I go here you could see these things such as

like one minute I have 252 of them five minute 30 minutes 1 hour they can be even building specific so this is like I can speed up four hours by healing hospital and let's say five times I have 35 minutes one speed up on the research stting the straight so yeah kind of the thing is that they also have ads and we can talk about that right now uh because the Forex itself and I think this is one of the first Forex game that I've seen actually video rewarded that's implemented in it done a couple reviews on for with rewarded ads which on yeah but like zero revenues on top yeah it was like really small so is this one by the way but yeah the one oh there the one okay I saw something else as well there's the one on the world energy that you're using to complete quests and like the interactions on the main map you can watch this three times per day if I understand correctly uh then there's the one if you're missing something in your

inventory regarding the resources oh yeah that's that's true I don't know if I'm able to show you this one because I have Just sh ton of resources and I of course you are you have maybe don't have enough to uh where we are we can try because I can again use the time to speed up things they're so hidden there placement so it doesn't really like yeah they're in here like to yeah to speed up things or if if you're missing whatever resources you can you can literally buy time here that's that's like part of it so if I need to upgrade it to Warehouse 18 I literally can let's yeah there you go it's so easy and too easy I would say it's because like everything can monetize here to the degree that like everything can be bought with money that's that's it's like one of the hardest or largest economies that I ever know regarding game genres that I mean Forex Forex of course so here we are this is the menu looking so if you run out of resources

of course it offers you your again consum resources in items that you have here so if I whatever press this that I whatever get some but if you scroll down of course there's packs there's uh the option to buy with hard currency immediately and somewhere there lower you can buy it from the guild Warehouse or you can watch an ad and get 30,000 which is by the way not scaled which is very wrong because in the beginning it it's in then it's completely useless yeah well maybe because it's not a very much integral part of the whole Revenue why you bother like I don't get it why you even bother maybe they just you know want to move the kind of a Canon fold through the early ranks so they give them like a big advantage to watch ads and squeeze ads out of them at least then you know main players need to buy I have this wild assumption so I mean and it's it's could be completely thin foil Hatter here so so you know people are kind of used to

see used to see ads within like casual idle RPG type of things so you know like it kind of resembl with the illusion like yes helps with the illusion yeah it's just like Village yeah it's just literally putkin Village yeah but it's like yeah it doesn't you know help you any in anything basically the revenue is not even uh well yeah significant to show on the chart quickly do it because like yeah so uh with a DA around 150 to 160k a day I assume here CU it's is so well hit maybe only 20% of users actually engage with ads and maybe the ones that do watch one 1.2 meaning that right now ad revenu is about $1,000 a day or 30 31 $30,000 a month so it's like anemic compared to yeah yeah yeah it's like one day 3K per day it's like it's nothing yeah but it's as I said like for when you're starting this and this kind of whole Base building mechanic because Base building mechanic

gets unlocked first before the Forex map so it looks like just an RPG with Base building mechanic and could be you know oh this could still be something like Empires and puzzles you know they have kind of similar they're using the Forex map there as like Base building there but yeah they don't have the Forex map itself which these guys definitely have so yeah maybe just for those actually play the game to uncover all of this because if you look at the like how the screenshots look like and like what's the creatives are all all about never shown in the yeah and even in the story is like no nothing anywhere close to actually saying Forex for instance this one level 53 I'm playing this game literally nearly for a month now every single day and you need to play every single day by the way because you're then you're [ __ ] yeah your clown will kill you themselves they will just kick you out and then kill you in the process that's how root rootless these games are um yeah going back in a little bit to the for Forex map so we know how these kind of quest Quest work and at some point they can run out of those and they

evolve themselves there's some kind of a chance to get more and the more you do the more like better ones you get blah blah blah it's kind very easy mechanic but in the end what really matters here is engaging within this kind of a clan resource economy the usual exterminate exploit expand and uh what's last one the Forex kind of a formula uh expand exterminate exploit and ex yeah forgot the for one I get to my mind in the meantime well I think we need to to find someone else on the game design s who actually knows what he's talking about should shouldn't shouldn't be like that Felix or what do you think yeah I think we should invite J.R he had some opinions before and I think his dad just silenced him yeah yeah yeah exactly he had some opinions before we need some we need some young blood so for instance you see here uh like under my town hall

there's a guy which town hall is burning because he probably got attacked by like the clan that we are currently racing on as the Gil arm RS this one talking [ __ ] yeah yeah it's literally very important to even know in which clan you go because they are like allies with each other and there's literally like hidden deals done in the meantime and the Clans kind of it's always the survival of the fittest because the map always if we zoom out here in every single Forex this is the same rule you start from the edges of the map this is a pretty just move yeah just move the CER right to the center because there's the most resources the treasures the the Buffs everything's there and you're kind of moving this direction the problem is the more you move into this direction the more the chance you get completely evaporated by just a stronger enemy that that's how it works so let's say in the guild that I'm currently or clan we have this snack Guild and we are friends with peerto peer one and then the top one is our enemy even though they say it should be friends but like whatever you're competing with them I know my last Guild

got literally evaporated because some Guild just decided like let's take them out and what the game does uh you see already here a little bit maybe that some of the people are scattered around the edges of the map so there's this kind of a fail failback mechanism that the game has that if you get attacked too much you literally get teleported out of the way to the edge of the map to be like the can consumed consumed consumed so literally discarded from the battle that that's how it works you can still teleport back and pay your way and blah blah blah but you know if the whole Guild is like that you know it's dead so usually what what happens you actually need to port to the heart of your guild this kind of a center because then you're strong because you're protected nobody can gets to you otherwise you know the Str in numbers the usual there and this is by the way very demanding and it completely changed the game playay philosophy of you going and playing that idle RPG suddenly you need to play just the four Forex because with Forex RPGs just move the way yeah yeah

like I still need to progress the PAAD because I still have that like Kill U I'll tell you why and this is the important part why this game isn't just some kind of a [ __ ] duct tape version of let's put ping creatives into onboarding and Mas something else you mean is better than kingdom guard yes it's better than kingdom guard that's that's what my assumption as well the mechanics are connected and this is the this is the point why we think this is a new Paradigm here because this game is pretty much two games built into one and very nicely connected so the first connection here is that my Army and my team is supported by these Heroes we've seen that with like U rise of Kingdoms they also has Heroes that like but now in my team I have literally this kind of a team of Heroes which is this kind of one March Cube each of the guys in my team actually carry soldiers so if I go this guy he level literally his level increases the amount of soldiers that he

can carry which determines his strength on the Forex map yeah but you you kind of gathered these soldiers in the idle RPG part uh no no no you you create yeah yes you you set them free on on the goal man very few of those yeah but still like that's like how you kind of connect them to the player yeah yeah you introduce the player the solders that's way but you actually bu them here and if you build them you need to really kind of you know upgrade the [ __ ] out of them because the moment you let me just show you uh you see I'm on soldiers level four and it goes all the way to solders level 10 and these already takes like 48 takes three and a half hours to create yeah 10 will take probably like three days to finish or something this is because what they did here again they simplified the game a little bit because usually what happens you have these soldiers under research

skill trees so you first need to research the giant whatever super prequisite connected skill 3es draging Rison kingdoms to even be able to kind of create these soldiers but again they did a nice job of simplifying some of the Forex mechanics in favor of putting the idle RPG Squad base RPG mechanics on top of them to make it more streamlined that's very good like the mechanic with the soldiers the other important thing is that uh there's gear of course like your typical AFK AR Ina load out you can you know upgrade the gear enhance it even Ascend It Whatever stuff like that uh the thing is that you use the world energy for bosses in the RPG idle RPG map so if we go into the idle RPG map and I show you right here near the last boss that I killed you actually can grind the bosses there because if I go to a boss encounter and I kill it afterwards I can again go there and kill the boss

see I'm just on difficulty eight let me let me kill him mayor yeah Mr Mayor probably gets killed very fast here last time he G me get I know doesn't matter you fight Milton Penny bags no you can't well what do you mean Penny bags is running behind the scenes we fought it like multiple times on the podcast anyway uh so you see he drops a chest yeah and that chest is pretty much like a random gacha roll that I open for the world map energy that can use on the same Forex world map same Forex RPG it drops some stuff and there's a chance that it can drop these resources oh yeah okay and I can kill this guy until I deplete all of these kind of resources which are very good by the way because there's like literally hard currency behind it and stuff like that resources into the Forex map everything even heroes yeah yeah yeah even heroes and when I have that when I finish it I move to next B again spend uh energy so it's very very nicely connected it's I still

am using it and it also fits the AFK Arena gameplay because um let me how do I even get out over here now I think yeah because we use the portal mechanic we need to walk all the way to the portal anyway uh now you just have the yeah I know it's fine why how how could I yeah where are you where are you there you go village Village yeah village Village it's not anymore Village yeah so back in the village uh we have we have the as I said like the connection there but we have the typical AFK Arena Saga here like it's exactly the same that it you know it uh creates idle resources in the meantime and at some point you get stuck here you cannot progress like Every Idle RPG is done this way you get stuck in the main mode and side mod unlock and you need to grind and upgrade and what you do in the meantime here you do the Forex stuff yeah because Forex stuff is very demanding like actually my just my starting session here it just is

all around clicking these notification badges and like going through all the things setting up stuff setting up that I I have my building queue full I have my research queue full I have my soldiers doing something on the map usually I send them gathering for these three to four hours long timers on the main Forex map then I need to go and like again continue building soldiers these needs to be running at all times because you're wasting time if you're not doing that next thing you are very good in the time efficiency in yeah exactly you had you had this other farming mechanic again for your Heroes helps your Forex map you have the let's say the latest boss and you can attack there's so much battle passes and like events basically you can play the whole [ __ ] day yeah yeah you can play completely okay the whole whole day it's like no problem there there's like the guild race event then let's say the this one where there's like so much deals is being spamed at you like so many and the thing is that there's multiple battle passes even that let's say where it is

yeah and and by the way this is the this is the most devious thing that they use I'm I'm just like this is this is chef's kiss as Felix would say so yeah Felix and some other people suddenly on the on the on the biggest deals that they want to promo all the time they will put the special notification badges as you would expect from normal badges because let's say whatever normal badges like okay I I do this I read all of it it goes away if I do this one it goes away and if I do this one okay Guild Master is screaming that we need to do something I will get back to the yeah because yeah good evening guildies tomorrow's event is going to be a PVP event I recommend shielding if you can because it's likely to be a blood pad yeah this is your this is your casual Monday in the Forex um yeah but the the notification badge is gone see but here the notification badge on daily special keeps appearing four times a day can you watch to get rid of it or something no you click on it it gives you nothing

gives you literally nothing it's just there provoke you yes but you need to click on it and then suddenly you are in the free offers section yeah because this is the very good step up offer that I've seen like multiple times that works very well and they're promoting the [ __ ] out of it so in two hours I'll get another notification with shitty resources giving me nothing just to get rid of it they do this all all over the place pretty much like all over game um yeah as said there's multiple events running for instance there's this wheel one again where I have like battle passes daily Quest reward schemes offers offers offers offers and like these things keep just going and see like I exact same hot sale Pack 12 which is one time offer for 199 which is the most selling thing see here that let's say this event which is the Dragon Year event with the wheel I still have the previous one running for like Dragon

Ball whatever event like uses exactly the same mechanic same template they don't care they just SL two of them at once you know they care about the money yeah exactly and this brings me to one other image that I wanted to show you because last time it was Valentine's event and we can check this one this is the degree that these games will go for so there was this Valentine event where needed to complete missions to kind of finish the chocolates here whatever in order to kind of eat these packages you need to complete both the horizontal that and vertical kind of rows here and columns and the last one the diamond one here you know what it says it says make any inner purchase throughout the day you want to complete it there you go go pay yeah just pay please but not even please just pay yeah so that's the one locking the last reward literally that's the end of the event you want Avatar framing okay that means you're aay that that's that's how this game so yeah they the monetization is just

you know endless here they don't care because as I said there's the very rootless Cutthroat survival of the fittest mechanic Only the strongest gland Will Survive Only the strongest clowns will get into the middle and all the Canon fold the people that can keep up will just kind of die in the process unfortunately that's how Forex games Works always have worked and will ever work I think I'm part of the Tik Tok generation I have no attention span for these games there's no ads like it just what like no it's it's like like like like I show you here uh by the way the guild mechanics they they work perfectly here I still constantly need to kind of help your guild get some stuff free if somebody is doing something in your gu for instance here see snack purchase a pack in the super deal so if somebody purchases an offer it gives a benefit to every single member of The Guild and you see it by the way this is this is done like same implementation is rise of Kingdoms it's just Forex standard uh the

other thing also here is that um you really need to kind of engage with the guild for instance like I read the not before because the guy like the Guild Master or whatever Alliance is doing it literally gives you orders so let's say whatever guys we did this we're going to do this and we're going to capture this checkpoint that checkpoint it gets very very very social based very fast at some point like high level gaml the objective of the game are designed in a way that you cannot do them solo so from like for instance my level 53 yeah I I switch three guilds already like because I the previous ones were I a guild [ __ ] no no no I was just like too good for for for all the other people there and they weren't moving anywhere SL so I I need to move to a stronger Guild you know yeah of course so you like it you like it stronger no no you don't get anywhere within the game that's the point like it's like in World of Warcraft if you want to get the best gear you need to go on rates or or you know big big things which is like 20 people in order to get

somewhere so this is how the game operates like social mechanics done very well but the key Point here as I said is that the the soldiers or sorry the characters the heroes that we have here are completely connected to the Forex gam playay so if I even if I let's say want to upgrade this guy more go to Castle 24 there's there's the thing like go upgrade so it's very nicely connected it's l like you take AFK Arena you take rise of Kingdoms and you do this and it works now kiss exactly and it has triple the span depth of the original AFK because it's a Forex game now it's well that's thing like it's not only a Forex game it's like Forex and then like multiple layers yeah Forex Forex RPG basically and you have so much of these like power progression layers you have you know you have your own Armory where you can craft gear that's gives you bonuses even by the way the heroes they have like tactics bonuses it gives you

like like similarly in AFK Arena like which lineup is the best because let's say this guy he has a bond with this other guy which can synchronous with this other guy there's also the elemental system so you can see it here that like I have the faction bonus faction AA whatever counter system it's very you have do you have also the the the guild slot bonus we can also check that by the way where's are we are we seriously doing more of these Forex games because like from admon perspective this is um very exciting this is the future man this is the future no it's not it is it's not for admon though so not for ad yeah this is the future of mobile gaming which is coming from the other side of the spectrum as we were covering hybrid casual yeah why don't they even have a like offer wall explain to me that Remo shouldn't offer wall be perfect offer wall maybe they just don't care yeah it's going to be like very minimum there so few users that just give up with our life savings for the thing is that slutting imagine imagine that like um

your iip sources like where most of the IPS are going so imagine the chart pie of AFK Arena how the iips are kind of spread there so most of the stuff gets through gacha offers on gacha mostly or hero upgrades and stuff like that here I guess 80% of stuff is coming from the Forex mechanics yeah because of the upgrading the resources the soldiers the peace Shields whatever something something so it shes the engine it's literally like you know you have your hybrid car and it starts with with oil or whatever gas and then it switches to electric and just is this almost connected to what you said to Mika um when we were discussing these like more ad monetization features and you said look there is a social mechanic at the end game and like you don't want to add more ad monetization placements you just don't want a piece of white whales yes

yes yes there's also Place into that because the guilt even though and and this is the part exactly that's a good point this is the part where you want to keep your white whales white whales are players that never pay but has giant social engagement and that drives the guild going forward so you could see here that let's say my guild there's a lot of people with default avatars yeah lot of people with default avatars if you want to have a non default avatars like this guy or that guy need to pay they are the payers so so it's usually that these kind of power power payer whales needs to be accompanied by lot of white Wells which are pretty much their minions as they're storming other people no because if if they are not in the game then the game dies because well you would be just playing Five against five and that's it it doesn't make any sense yeah it needs to have massive numbers yeah and also I guess um you like you said you kind of time is very essential here and you don't want to waste time by watching ads you just want to be you know either like socially in the guild

or just playing the game actually yeah yeah and keep in mind that time can be literally bought because it is a currency maybe they should skip it yeah exactly if you combine if you combine the da of all the Forex games like is it like a user base that everyone's going after like that does like a million people worldwide or is it bigger you know this the last Forex game we did was 120k Da this one is 50k da you 300K it says 200 250 same right but like is it worldwide the audience like 200 no mil like 1 mil the strategy I see here is that by widening the funnel so much now within the onboarding they are able to get non Forex people into the mix and somehow some of those non Forex people to be trained into Forex people to enlarge the audience yeah because was like total addressable Market that's like I guess that's the question Felix is asking What's the total addressive

Market Forex is it 1 million people 5 million 10 million I have no idea yeah it's not that big like these asking about I'm asking about the Tam like how many people would be it's not that big but the the the thing is that you know before in the old days of whatever 2016 you would have ma Zone at the top of the charts all the time with mobile strike and game of war and they would have their shotgun marketing meaning that you open your free and K up AR yeah yeah exactly and they would literally have like they 15 they won 15% retention because they would get everyone into the game but you know nobody STI nobody stick because the game was like your typical Forex and build this build that tutorial for 40 minutes you were just thrown into this Forex uh town I like what the [ __ ] I'm supposed to do here like yeah well this just can you just mute yourself when you're just blowing your nose what the [ __ ] I just did that E Yeah but too

late please mute that that's disgusting no no no no no I just yeah I will keep it here just for everybody to know like how disgusting he is obviously just mute yourself I'm going to go in Middle I'm in the middle of I'm in a different country I'm going to go to another I'm going to go wash my hands and now I I don't know what I went to say Jesus Christ totally destroyed for Sim clicking simulator anyway yeah yes so yeah you're you are kind of holding hands of the player with the the scripted tutorial but here you actually play the game you have higher chance of actually converting to the Forex player afterwards because well you I already invested time okay let's see what this is whatever but yeah it's like that's that's why the onboarding is like it like it is but as soon as I saw the Forex map I was like oh I'm done thank you very much bye it was just like like this is fun and then I'm like H out yeah but the thing is like as soon as I saw saw the the layout and the design of these like offers and everything I was like hm wait

a second this doesn't feel right and then I was like okay well this the resources I needed to um free the the soldiers from the cage is like yeah like four out of my like thousand of whatever it's like H another another sign of Forex because this is the same thing as as you said in the Kingdom guard like it's completely me meaningless to have like millions of resources for that like Tower Defense and then suddenly you don't don't even need at least this is a nice kind of evolution that you actually kind of need this to play all the aspects of the game so it's it's an upgrade can we look at the creative it's very very smooth I would say even smoother than U white out survival currently oo I would no I wouldn't say the why the survival balloon thing is uh so elegant no no why the surviv balloon thing is very is different don't get me wrong but what I'm saying is the longterm connection between these two modules where the Heroes the idle RPG the I'm actually looking forward to our next

episode about this because I think like there is one game which does like [ __ ] amazing things and uh it's already we already see it on the revenue which is like [ __ ] like 5x of 4X of what we see here we have to do more Forex I mean like there's no ads people people on our podcast have unanimously said 100 people 100% of our us listeners have said that they listen only because of the ads 100% 100 % of Felix 100% of what 100% of five people is actually like looking forward in this like honestly yeah like a different audience segments anyway uh you want to yeah tell us something more yakob or we just I think we're done uh what I'm going to end up here with the teaser for the second part uh which is we're going to cover that on March 8 because we know that this game 18 18th yes sorry because we know that this game is part of a bigger conspiracy uh that we're going to uncover on March 18 as

some of you maybe already know you will get you will [ __ ] your P will no more when you just look for yakub's next sneeze when he blows his nose that's the sign move but all also like for you and I saw I saw this on the screen already like during yacob's playing the the brightest of you connected the dots already when looking into or watching the the YouTube video because there is a clue in the video there is a clue so if you his no no if you found the clue let us know in the slack Channel and I I have no idea what we'll do for you but it's like this you are the brightest from all the all the fans all everybody because there's the your mind will be blown until we can get to oh yeah not no but mind definitely but we need a little bit more time because these games are massive to cover like you need to play them for a long time I'm not I cannot do like a proper Forex review in one week of play through I'm sorry that's how it works and we just yeah discovered this thing

like minutes agoes ago few days ago but few days ago but yeah we connected the dots uh but you know and we kind of play the creatives yes um so uh the question for you guys is what is the biggest channel for this well I will turn off the sound so you're iing or no it is uh TI sh hell no you were just been de demoted to Fourth best UA manag because third one is the grand piette behind Felix mhm anyway to be fair that was a gift from a client and uh they're very good at UA so yeah there you go easy now um so they as we know they launched in January so this is a January date range so I'm going to go to February and then uh

you're almost right yob but in January uh their biggest channel was Google and I was like okay interesting and then there you have we have unity and Facebook and honestly I saw this game popping into my face on Facebook so much then I brought it up and then actually we discovered this in our sensor T um small dashboard as well so it's like ah okay so they they they was really running a lot of a lot of creatives on Facebook YouTube and then unity and some some other [ __ ] but yeah you see there is a Tik Tok actually let's see what was the Tik Tok yeah that's what I saw that's what I thought like nothing very specific connected to Tik Tok just like random one or two creatives and it seems like this is what Asian South Korea Japan now Japan no I guess well well I don't know but not anything close to West and uh then we

should see like what is the kind of geost structure anyway so let's go to the actual videos and you don't so you see this creative is like huh okay it's like it's fine it looks like uh Sur a little bit archero yeah you know getting all these like interesting uh literally the bar from Survivor iio on the top yeah exactly yeah exactly the same I mean these kind of troops those are like small Pokemons looks a little bit like that but then like this is Google only well Android only and we have something like this there's a nice piano music I turned it off so your uh ears won't uh explode maybe you can blow your nose again that's sound man maybe we have a new intro with like yaku blowing the nose oh my god do what and and by the way I'm

getting this told by the two guys who have not wireless headphones in 2020 and what's like I don't get I don't get the argument like why why should I have the wireless head I want to see this creative don't we can fight later I want to here we can fight no like it's basically this like we are looking at four Heroes destroying like Mass battles or like Mass like hordes of uh enemies and then kind of using the food to actually get more and more uh Heroes and that's that's basically it I mean it's they have this a little bit in the game a little bit it's in the game actually this is connected to the idle RPG uh kind of element right so you have you are freeing yeah you're freeing the heroes well soldiers then you are getting more Heroes as you go then you fight other kind of enemies so I mean make makes sense and also so what we found out when I had this um U workshop

with one of the one of the companies last week because oh that's what I wanted to say we actually work as consultants I kind of teased it at the beginning but you know we actually do the work so we had this work UA workshop and we found out like for Facebook there are like few elements in the creatives that actually work better than the others and then like here you can see this was also I saw this on on Facebook so many times and it's very important here the color scheme or the color palette so you have green background and then you have blue for uh let's say the PO cre yeah friendly Circle and then you have red for enemy Circle and you can see this in the next episode where we where we kind of discuss the other game it's the same kind of the blue and red color scheme it's super big in that game and it's working really well I saw it in different creatives so green red and blue kind of um colors it has to be your creatives at least on Facebook so I mean it's it's proven and then we have this

like all different kind of again it's this resembles a little bit um what game guys um Royale Rush rash Royale yeah rash Royale exactly so it's like kind of like a little bit of Tower Defense honestly I saw I saw some they're creatives yeah yeah yeah fair enough fair enough fair enough they're creatives I saw some some games actually which are kind of like Survivor IO of games uh having the copying top heroes creatives which makes zero sense but okay what am I to judge oh this is amazing this is exactly what I to much was sending me this and again you're just fighting Heroes it's this is a little bit closer to Hero Wars in terms of like upgrading the gear and there is like like such a great metal music in the background but again it's all connected to Heroes enemies then you get the food then you upgrade your your hero and then just kill everybody this looks

amazing this is like I saw it like today like three or four times on Instagram it's great creative it's great creative yeah no it's great and this is I'm this we saw this already so it's like that's like my main main problem oh no you know what is this cop copying from nexter I mean oh yeah yeah it's complete Hero Wars it's complete Hero Wars but at least the hook is nice right yeah so it's like nice music you get more uh More Heroes uh there's level 10 hero maybe they get kill but they just took the hook they don't do to like plus plus numbers play yeah yeah exactly but you know like what what it's 200 yeah it's their numbers hook but yeah it's there at least it's not yeah exactly which is terrible by the way but then we go to February and then what do we see here it's all YouTube but not all YouTube it's already upload so guys we

can definitely see you know there are some small numbers since like the beginning of February but now they're scaling on uplo in since what like five days so I'm pretty sure that we should be able to see quite the nice increase in terms of the revenues in the upcoming days and weeks so what is the Appling creative let's see it's a playable at obviously what else right what else it's a playable at saw that straight away what was it a m one it's an app oh get Gusty yeah we need to do that testing soon huh yeah I know we discussed oh Jesus Christ like this is like how can you even play on the on emulator like this such a hard such a hard time actually playing this this playable creative Jesus Christ what's too fast for you yeah I'm super yeah I'm too too

fast okay but it's exactly what we saw in the in in the video right so you gathered this lit play the and then yeah and then you get what would you get oh what's happening oh okay now kill the dragon yeah yeah yeah I can't click on this because of whatever the page attempted to navigate away yeah okay but it's like you know like this is external source so very good very good so that's that's basically that's basically it I mean they don't have like so many different cre no Forex no Forex anywhere never bet there is integral look there is integral and then but there is no playable on integral okay let's see oh I saw this oh my god oh I saw this I saw this I love this Korean creatives yeah yeah I mean I I saw this actually the same thing or in US it's the exactly the same setup so there's like girl and a guy sitting in the car

and the girl is just laughing her ass off so we should I hope I can actually see that somewhere they have so so sense of humor so good no let's see let's see I'm pretty sure I saw I saw this man like I saw it I saw it somewhere it was exactly the same setup and it's just like so funny but I don't I don't think I can find it one or Korean one also Western one yeah it was on the US and it was Korean people or was it Western people no it was West West people doesn't make any yeah it doesn't make any sense to actually have uh western eastern actors in the west yeah yes but we have some interesting oh now this is great oh my God yes this is great but this is different art like a different game exctly yeah yeah yeah exactly but it's you know the same i' play that game that looks better sounds like developer build no actually this this this this looks worse because this defitely have worse CPI that's exactly what I wanted to say this is more 3D kind of I mean still yeah it's more core

it's also very dark um I don't think like this kind of works the same way look we have some screenshots and then we have this again so they are definitely testing ah you see there this is also Kingdom guard man this is Kingdom guard this is Kingdom guard and Misty uh Misty Island oh this is Misty Island creatives oh my God yes this is so great so they are kind of experiment experimenting with new creatives finally because I was very skeptical about their kind of like January Global launch strategy like not so many different creatives and the depth wasn't there and this is actually interesting so it's completely Misty Island we had the Misty Island creatives in one of our episodes uh so if you want to go go back and try to find it you should you can this is exactly same you know you know what I'm going to share the Mystic Island creatives in in our select Channel just to cross compare just to compare yes M or maybe I just

going to you know what I'm going to just post produce it and then just show it next to next to this uh next to this video in the in the post production so you can compare this because it's exactly the same man it's completely oh my God I love it I love it yes okay we already saw this so you know like you need to kind of this is only Facebook so it's Audience Network Facebook and Instagram it's us so you need to kind of experiment with this all of this [ __ ] in here let's see if we have something on Tik Tok now not anymore yeah not anymore so yeah I think uh that's pretty much it from the from the creative side I mean it's it's interesting I mean it's not exactly uh Century games white out survival yet it's not exactly the other game you're going to talk about yet but it's also already like very very sophisticated well I just wanted to

search for the you know yeah they made like 1.5 million in January now they made six and you know this is exactly the trajectory we saw with white on Survival so they made like two million then like eight next next month and now they're making 70 yeah yeah because the p sticks there the glob of P sticks there with Forex game so then yeah it's it's kind of yeah it's kind of in take minimum million mon Forex audience sticks very hard that's true and now if you look at the countries obviously so it's us then Taiwan South Korea Japan and then we have Germany Hong Kong France and other tan countries but yeah it's like us is top one but then you know it's Taiwan and South Korea and Japan obviously so it's like yeah top four countries like us and the three other countries from Asia very very nice and uh again what we're going to talk about in two weeks you're just

going to be blown away we found out so many important marketing things on that other game thanks to our friends obviously because we can't be everywhere in the whole world but it's like it's so so good it's really good yeah uh anyway I can I can stop sharing because don't say the names don't it's very big and it's uh yeah thanks to our friends of the podcast who actually brought it up and it's you know those developers develop the game I'm excited I will be more than just eye candy so that's good of course no worries no worries the thing is like on my screen you are very blurred so it's you are not even ey candy I said I candy and you said I bleach I bleach yes what you kissed your son with a mouth what what yeah yeah exactly I mean he's blowing you his nose on the podcast now he's like insulting

you as like like should I bring knife or buy KN in istan just you know but you can't bring it to istanb man so he's like you need to buy a new one anyway oh so you are actually worried about your plays on the podcast okay that's good so you're try to find maybe I should sharpen my swords for all right guys let's end this next episode we'll have more ads in it that's what we all want yeah yes and again thank you very much for all the support uh basically all the time uh we have the 55% of you not subscribing so please do so on on YouTube and Spotify as well uh it's gr it really does make a difference please it really helps yeah it helps bring us like interesting interesting people on the podcast as well and we had a lot of guests honestly we will try yeah it's pretty big names pretty big name yeah it's not only Yu Felix and mat anymore let's end

it okay thank you very much guys see you cheers [Music] [Applause] [Music] byebye [Music] of course of course you have to no also uh yakob if you want then you you screen share and then move the you keep the sensor Tower data there and you just move the emulator in the in the middle the middle so in the middle yes so you have on the right you have the the revenues and in the middle the where is like the value of basically nothing uh you just have it in the

middle of the screen so something like this yeah sh share the screen exactly this is fine I mean this is okay thing is because then I'm kind of if it's it's cro and I was like I would need to do a lot of lot of the set things I I can put it in the middle and also before you start speaking for soundchecking can you stand up and do a twirl and sit down it's for sound check purposes [ __ ] you no seriously your hands like a ballerina yeah I'm doing it right now hey you need to do it as well look yeah yeah yeah s hey check check check check two one yeah check mic check mic check hello hello you have both how much better the sound is yeah I don't have wireless headphones why would I have you don't no and you and I don't have a boomer [ __ ] you yeah I was like well like it's it's look it's connected to the F the [ __ ] microphone I don't care I don't give a [ __ ]

look