Empire Takeover - 4X Hybridcasual review: UA, Creatives, Ad monetization, Game design (#77)

most probably so instead of 16k you will earn 18 well if it's like five people there like what like what would what do what would you think like the intials will do BN as go back to time machine time machine zero zero okay because the da was never that high in this game even that the P was like it's Forex Forex don't have high da that's why they don't have ads that's fine yeah these ones did they but now I mean like that's kind of like proof of why this is no [ __ ] gaming podcast to and a half Gamers sharing actionable insights dropping Knowledge from our day-to-day user acquisition game design and AD monetization jobs we are definitely not discussing the latest industry news but having so much fun let's not forget this is a 400 a.m. conference discussion Vibe so let's not take it too seriously okay welcome everyone uh this is session number 77

my name is mat I'm Felix braberg and I'm we are hosts thank you very much welcome so what to start with I think Gamescom party amazing thanks for coming uh planning to do more of these in the future you should m is actually excited he's just pretending he not excited right now when he were like talking about this I'm excited in the inside I'm excited in the Insight can you deliver that with a bit more enthusi no no no no it was amazing no it's you should definitely come and see us um live also um solves the sound quality issues you had before and we had before with some live uh recordings but now uh so I'm the master of the the AI music and everything which is making wonders so we can record on the construction side and we should be fine so it was definitely good to see you face to face uh uh I was actually glad

I'm leaving on Thursday because uh it was really overwhelming honestly after two days of seeing everybody at Marriott um anyway so I think this is going to be the quickest review of all time because we are uh actually talking about Empire takeover today and uh we are reviewing a dead game thanks to Dr R over there so it's super interesting until the point it's not g are interesting you learn from them because they're yeah yeah it's yeah I'm really looking forward to see what we are looking at looking at here and and learning um but since we love our dear co-host actually doing it and since you're not famous for 20 minutes intros about things that nobody cares about but we are famous for getting straight to the point and actually bringing value so let's start Felix what you got before before diving into this game that Dr Remy are uh so astutely chose let me just start off by saying

yeah I got a lot of questions from the podcast two weeks ago about maloko and how much they're paying us or me uh nothing the only thing they paid us was a steak sandwich I do believe uh they expensed that so we got paid a steak sandwich is actually like if we're doing paid promotion on this podcast we'll always tell you and it will look like an advertisement and that's how we do paid promotion just to get that out of the way uh malos is one of those things that actually worked and basically I was excited because not a lot of things do work in admon so just Public Service Announcement saying if we do get paid by anyone you'll definitely yeah will know you'll know know um I think uh I have a gray admon part on this because it's such a good game I mean Remo maybe you can uh just can you show theame maybe just maybe like uh excite us all like why the [ __ ] we're talking about yeah like in in the quiet words of the Virgin Mary why am I reviewing this game yeah oh wow

this amazing unusual it's very unusual very unusual yeah very unusually Dead who it's yeah can you okay you just do your part first cuz like yeah you do yeah let's yeah let's let's let's do like that because uh honestly if we talk about this nobody will listen anymore so you want me to excite you for this game yeah yeah why the [ __ ] are we even talking about this yeah like I'm tell us because I never seen anything like this so yeah me neither it's like it's dead do not getting why we're talking about this [ __ ] we're including us too with Felix by the way but yeah who because it has very interesting Design Concepts in it and uh by the way by that and that how these two uh like to joke here the game was actually making a pretty big chunk of money it's not that was and by the way is I know it's still I yeah it still it makes like 700 enough jibber jabber like why why why are you excited Remo

yeah just let me finish the numbers part so people know the scale we're talking about talk about currently the game makes around 700k in iips on literally nearly Zero downloads a month a month 22,000 users right from 22,000 years it started somewhere like 20 like half of 2021 peaked in like April 2022 with something like one and a half one and a half million a month iips I don't know how much with ads but at that not yeah it's not that much but it's still like solid but it's still going I would say kind of stable even though on the download side it looks completely dead which says something about the Forex score Loop which kind of drags the whole thing with it sure so that's but I think uh we can be a little bit more generous here because uh I just um included in this Revenue numbers at sadness multiplier and sadness because we're always sad to see the tools that

are letting us down so we do have a remedy for this that we're going to show our dear viewers very soon but it's it's going to be beautiful this multiplier yeah because it's like I think it's 2x so right now from the other tool I saw are making 1 million yeah let's just go back so yeah no no like they they make a million a month because of the sadness multiplier that's it okay you make a million a month okay yeah you can you can okay so the sadness multiplier is 1 million a month uh no it's not the multiplier is like 2x okay uh but whatever like if you if you have a multiplier of of million then you know they're making [ __ ] ton of money anyway anyway the other interesting thing regarding the numbers the retention seems pretty solid pretty solid where did you where did you get the retention number Solid because when I looked at it was [ __ ] terrible clown dat clown data tool one or clown data tool two it actually told like it went to [ __ ] ly I don't know why from

somewhere like March to April or February sorry February but before February 2023 it was like 10% day 30 and like 18% day seven which is I saw I saw 4% day 30 and uh like Day N like 1% basically even in 2022 the like overall the whole period there you go there were great data tools yes security guards yeah I mean that that doesn't make any sense this like uh retention numbers because if they have strong retention numbers they wouldn't if they have no strong retention numbers then they would maybe went through the whole Forex anyway yeah yeah but day one is like 40% that's what I see and then day S1 which is which feels weird anyway yeah so the thing is that uh this is in the end the hidden Forex but the Forex is still heavily simplified the game starts basically with the usual kind of a creative levels like levels copied from

our favorite creative I even was able to found uh different levels I don't know even how you get there normally like through this kind of idle menu so there's actually they even have like I found like three levels so they have the the assault one which is our favorite can you so you can finally play this [ __ ] that's what they that's what they had in the in the static images actually yeah so they they actually they actually have this as some kind of like separate mode or something I don't know how how it I don't even know how I got there because what these guys have like they pretty much build not only these kind of hyper kind of creatives into it but they build pretty much the whole AFK Arena into it on top of it they have pretty much all the like core mechanics of AFK you know like RPG we'll get to it so you have this thing then you have the the main combat thing which is now our favorite Mushroom War s which is by the

way pretty can you just say that this is the this is the fou right can you like yeah this is not there's even one more within the F which is the one you're cutting the grass and the way for for for guys I don't know how this even called like who uses it where you have like again these small idiots and then you want to can cut their weight for them through the multi like an upgrade for the gate game like I would say same wait cuz when I was playing this like uh like two days ago the fatou was literally I had to play until Level 7 in this and then I was given the basis to attack others there's different games different meaning games like three to four I think they have so there's even a PVP like this like PVP version of this so and this by the way gets kind of really complicated because I can already use my hero as you see on the bottom which charges up I have my separate upgrade three just for this thing and they're like multiple opponents in these game modes later down the line and it takes really like a little bit of more thinking how to actually solve these

things because you this can get like super complicated and they have like Minds whatever obstacles like these other things the rules how these towers work like it's it's literally very very fleshed out so it's not really your usual like we copied some UA creative they actually took the time to like build this into like a proper puzzle game like II is enjoyable like literally of course you do beting these I I that's why we talk about this game yeah uh and by the way you can skip the levels but not all of them see I can skip just one more and then I need to do it there's no way around it so you cannot just skip them like in every other games where they are completely optional this is part of main progression now and I like how the UI looks like this is like unfinished build from like 10 years ago yeah it looks like the whole game looks like it if we go to the Forex part it's same [ __ ] like looks like some

unfinished [ __ ] like if I go attack someone uh yeah let's just just get this guy it actually looks like a whatever yeah Windows 998 yeah see yeah so so it looks kind of like super low Budgy I don't know you how to call it but it worked before like one and a half million Mone isn't like a small Feit to do how much did they make in total before it died uh to I found 20 Millions which could be easily 30 I guess exactly and keep in mind they still making around 7 to 800k a month a month still yeah without from like 22,000 users as well right like it's nothing because it's Forex man like if these Clans stick like like for instance look here this is my clan all these people are [ __ ] completely into it it's Alli what are you talking about all Bots no Bots can play our game but B won't pay in your

game well that's true so they have the usual like Alliance thing with all the helping thing and claiming thing and whatnot and you know that's the like the usual thing like it's pretty much all in this kind of shitty UI then they have their AFK Arena part where literally they copied the like the lady with the beer here in the tavern where they have their gacha of course why not so there your wife is not W it's just like lazy lazy copying stuff so they have the as I said like the hero system from AFK Arena like pretty much to to to the like last thing uh whatever let's pick some other character interesting how we can upgrade these like even if you look at the upgrade processes looks so prototype and like yeah it looks like an MVP yeah looks like an MVP but actually I think they just you know saved on speed and just like C everything into it the other interesting thing is that this is pretty

much my whole Forex base so you have the just really necessary buildings so one building is for doing the unit uh training the other one is the gacha building you don't even need this one then you have the hospital one for Ved units this is the destruction of property mechanic and then you have the research trees here so and that's there like you don't need more than five buildings to do a Forex here okay so all those other Forex that you see there like 20 buildings in every single one like all of dragons whatever like whole Camp is full then this is it it can be simplified to this then you have those offers walking around like that's a pretty nice touch to it like the lady asking you if you want to take her home and by the way there's this golden goblins Crea do that doesn't really do anything I don't know what he does because he was like collects Three Wood when he collect he collects like nine wood in every run yeah runs runs around 400k wood in my inventory well it's a very very big hard

worker working hard all day long may likes wood yeah yeah yeah but but there's this like it's it's really interesting how they all combine it together because as I said uh the the thing that probably mat will show later is the top war thing because this is basically top war tutorial again copy so they're just adding more and more of these kind of sudden appearance Island that you need to defeat and then they get added to your main island and which pretty much like this one of those like top four tutorials which is under Forex yeah so they knew what they were copying but as I said like it's still heavily simplified on the first look like you saw Felix it looks like hyper casual but then slowly it morphs into Forex but it's still looks on that kind of a shitty prototype art level that you think it's still hyper casual so this is the first 4ex game in the world that has a hyper casual onboarding or F uh no no no no no we've seen many like this it's it's not like that it's that they stay in the team of it because top war at

some point they go away from it and pretty much show you their main visual like how it's nice and everything effects blah blah blah these guys stay on the hyper hyper casual kind of a production values let's call it and keep it for the rest of the experience so it seems very consistent that this is still hyper casual level production quality so that I never seen ever before their ads are I would say pretty good at some point they're still like just rewarded videos I I found like pretty good pretty good what tell me finished my Adon I finished my second paragraph on my admon like scene and I saying like literally what I'm going to say here to even say that this game is AD monetize bring shame on the whole concept of AD monetization no they do not have good ad placement Remo like what are you talking about forget there yeah so they have their idle part uh I don't know where it's even where

because like I'm still getting kind of confus yeah here it is so so pretty much they have like idle Park build into it nobody knows even about you know like the AFK Arena where guys are fighting on the main screen and you go and collect resources this is it and it's hidden behind like five menus and see like how much resources you get out of it like so much and then of course you can get more for ads so I bet Felix didn't find this one yeah I did but no one else will no one else will yeah you two figured it out congrats yeah yeah so it's it's really interesting how this work and actually pretty much made the revenue but the big question from my side why this stopped working because like seem to me it's still making a lot of money why would you think they would stop UA and like yeah exactly if this makes like 700k or well million a month like why not uh run away yeah doesn't make any sense and then I I also was looking like why they're not spending in trade and then the retention is kind of like n day

91% so I guess like that this could be the reason but if I look at the chart it doesn't seem like your usual you know oneit Wonder shark fin kind of a whatever fake fake creative suddenly we found a creative and we SC fake creative this is not X hero or some some kind of no no no it's not it's definitely not X hero it's just they started spending uh then they pecked and then suddenly in June there just they stopped spending at all that's that's the weirdest part like why why would sto spending when you just PE M like almost like 1 Point like 2.5 million uh a month and then they just St the UA it doesn't make any sense doesn't make any sense it doesn't make any sense for me like I I I would thought like this game would be kind of Genius but it's not that's why it's dead why are we reviewing it because we're learning from it okay yeah what did you learn tell us um I mean for ad no no wait wait wait like what design what like like what's the learning out of this tell me the

learning is that you can easily streamline this kind of hyper casual creative [ __ ] that we've seen all over the place into some kind of actionable progression what these guys did and then put it beside the Forex okay and still make a [ __ ] load of money with like super low production values and probably very low cpis well I wouldn't be so sure about those very low cpis when we look at the creatives it's just a very weird mix maybe they would have uh low cpis with different creatives but uh with what they this is this is the mystery for me in the story like on paper it sounds pretty good on numers it also sounds pretty good until start of this year not not even until the start of this year it's just like mid mid 2022 yeah yeah and then suddenly it collapsed coll August August yeah right yep well okay so that was the learning amazing thank you you all learn all learned a lot yeah

I mean uh admon uh yeah yeah yeah let's let's go I love this game for one reason one reason only it's completely proven Remo's statement that Forex games never have ads completely wrong that's uh when my love for Empire takeover ends this is probably one of the worst ad monetized games I've ever seen uh like I said before to say that this game has ad monetization brings shame on the whole concept of AD monetization so uh Empire takeover has four rewarded ad placements but they're so hidden that you don't really need to find them kind of in the fatou when you're playing the hyper casual like stuff you kind of are shown it but it's kind of just bolted on after every level there's a yeah exactly but you don't need to because basically the resources you get from the ad doesn't make sense so there's no reason forever to click on it and you can still skip the levels so it's just no real reason to ever watch or water ad so you know they might get

some accidental clicks here and day there so yeah uh as you'd expect I'd say the Imp is probably around 0.2 to 0.5 uh with an opt-in rate of maybe 30% if they're lucky probably closer to 20 so the ad unit is only visible for a short amount of time the rewards are pointless that you get from it so basically the kind of rule with ad monetization is you always need to have one rewarded placement that's always visible and basically also getting value from these placements so in the last 30 days this game has made an eyew watering $2,037 in ad revenue and it's I watering because I'm crying to myself because I'm asking why I'm spending my precious time reviewing such a pointless game and then I was like I was like no no no no I'll I'll give Remo benefit of the doubt and I'll basically go back to when they were shark Finning and basically go back to 2022 and see like oh let's see what's

going on there oh 200,000 daily active users so that brings us to $557 a day in ad Revenue back then or about $116,000 per month back in April 2022 was the ecpm you counting this on yeah it's my standard like yeah I filtered for the US and rest of the world but you think it would be much higher because it's Forex no there just no Impressions man like even if I trip is not making money man it's super hyping users it's high it's high value users yeah but even if I double the ecpm it's like okay instead of then ear 55 $50 a day is $1,000 a Dayo yeah yeah it's like I know it's sh like score is B+ Bad Plus terrible can I give it lower than a one I don't know I want to give Remo a bad score as well but he's also my friend so you know I I repeat my question from earlier today in the quiet words of the Virgin Mary why am I reviewing this game you're learning from

it as I told you it's very interesting I never seen like Forex on hyper casual production level quality everyone that does Forex is like [ __ ] great investment you don't do Forex is on low budget because you don't yeah but those Forex games make 20 million a month or they could be dead in the water that's also like you just don't see them could be yeah could be I mean these guys could have done without the ads month well 16k a month maybe 30 but yeah I don't I doubt it even if it's 30 I mean it's what is it like few I me also also the only ads I ever saw was from admob which leads me to believe I only think they have one ad Network installed most probably yeaha so yeah okay uh do you think by slapping interstitials and Banners on this would would help it or not what definitely wait wait I will answer it's it's going to increase the the daily revenue for 500 to 600 probably so instead of 16k you will earn

18 well if it's like five people there like what like what would what do what would you think like the insts will do B let's go back to time machine time machine zero zero okay because the The Da was never that high in this game even at the P was like it's Forex Forex is don't have high da that's why they don't have ads that's fine yeah this ones did they but I mean like that's kind of like proof of why it's not going to work in Forex right yeah if you put some ads there it's it's low daus but the very high quality users fine so you will earn money on the iip side not ads but don't worry I I know Ma is going to have really big insights on the UA side so let's just turn it over to UA oh I hope you are don't worry don't worry it's a learning experience I learned here that these guys didn't earn [ __ ] on ads and people tell me I'm mean on the podcast I know I know like it's see you know uh we're two against one in this

case because uh so what I've wrote here um on the UA part in the first sentence is this game is Dead look at that he dead yeah did so no you I spent thank you very much for listening we are done here hey hyy thank you okay bye until next time uh so but for the sake of the review I actually look at the the game when it was spending some money which was the first half of 2022 so uh not that much uh but iOS almost non-existent even in terms of revenues so uh there's no diu on iOS it was super interesting they just didn't care they're like nope yeah so there uh there was some spent happening on Android I guess so the game was downloaded almost like seven million times and made 19 Millions it's not actually that bad not that bad at all and since we have this sadness multiplier I think this could easily be

the 30 million lifetime Revenue as we as we said uh so this game peaked in June 2022 with 1.3 million revenues again sadness multiply I would say 2.5 so after turning off the UA in June 2022 which is I like no idea like why uh the game kind of declined and still making like 1 million a month given the multiplier uh where is the money coming from uh it's 50% R comes from us or 52% from us and then we have Germany Taiwan and other tier one countries so again why the fact they're not spending so I see the the day 90 retention 1% day 142 day 711 I guess day 34% which I guess this could be the reason but you said that the retention was actually good when they were spending so it's still kind of looks like a mystery question yeah do

you think this game turned a profit well now they when they actually it's based in China by Sky Dragon games if I get it right so my guess is yes yes for sure uh I think they were not spending as much uh when they were spending and now they're basically spending nothing for a year and uh they still make yeah they still makes money so whatever they spend they definitely got it back okay but anyway let's uh let's look at the the activities they've done back in 2022 uh so u channel mix this is some old school [ __ ] honestly they're spending now most of the money on Unity which is very surprising uh also it's surprising because they buy traffic from sources like Monopoly solitire build a bridge Solita Grand Harvest I didn't even know like Grand Harvest is ADS okay but then I saw a lot of Boom beat and boom hits games which were basically all

hyper casual so after Unity they have Google ads and then some Facebook lift of mopa last from the past yeah exactly and then very small TI and super super small uplo so which is basically it so it's like not that lot not a lot of things they've done uh but I also saw on Unity they were buying traffic from Kingdom guard also I didn't know like they have ads by the way kingdom heart is that's really much they didn't yeah I thought they didn't so that was that was the learning that I took from this game actually the kingdom guard has Forex but see it's a Forex taking traffic from Forex so my guess is their ecpm is higher on those ads than Mr Felix thinks here sure but even if it's like 500 my my high this one $25 right so even if I triple that yeah you know it's like it doesn't it doesn't make or break doesn't change anything you know yeah and then they were also buying rash Royale uh kind of ads as well we know

the RADS there yeah we know the RADS there yeah and then uh some Chinese uh publisher I have no idea or game I have no idea how how to say the name anyway so I know Felix uh you love interesting hooks we definitely have some uh but not sure if interesting or super sexist well you will see you want to have the screen uh sure um so they took a lot of inspiration from top war um as you mentioned as well Hero Wars main main Base building yeah and I guess some sexist [ __ ] game like game of Sultans or whatever the name of the game is but let's uh let's take a look so what do we have here but see this is one of the main learnings that uh you can pretty much build the whole game based on UA creatives like but this is learnings that we we already had like five times before but we never seen it applied oh horribly failed oh really how about the

kingdom guardan top four uh they didn't horribly failed they horribly failed I said they didn't they didn't okay okay so let's uh let's actually start what do want to see uh let's start with st the gages obviously okay so that's the sniper game that's a sniper game for sure and they have uh different sniper things they have this hyper casual comp which is basically I true like is true so yeah no fake in it's no fake yeah no fake uh and then we have they don't have or at least I haven't seen no well it's Hero Wars her Star Wars typical [ __ ] yeah and the same thing here so it's the Hero Wars inspiration this would be actually an amazing game if they build it what this mhm game creative like like they have in their puzzle levels okay be able to do that all right so what do we have uh

let's continue with the Hero Wars obviously yeah at least you have that was fake this doesn't exist yeah this is fake oh no [ __ ] Sherlock course it doesn't exist do you think it exist in the in Hero Wars why would you run in there with a 13 yeah that's the main takeway that's the main takeway you know like here takeover so I think this is something some Chinese uh thing because Kingdom guard also has their own logo in all the creatives uh so okay what do we have there I think we can yeah let's let's leave the sexy hook at the end so I think we can we can uh start with this the ones thetic Choice basically like okay where do it's like like an iteration on the Hero Wars it's just different only 2% of people can solve this one oh

yeah of course only 4% this is basically altered game play oh no [ __ ] it's basically like top war it's basically top War I mean you have this in the game yes but not really yes but not really and no look you saw the the end screen and no ads amaz so you know you're definitely not Li in in there uh we have fail scenario which is a game playay basically right this is in the yeah is in the game definitely you could go through the obstacle because they're destructible in the game oh nice well uh why is it get it gets complicated like uh like you you showed in the in the actual game play because I mean it gets very complicated yeah it's not easy yeah it's totally like there's landmines there's like three to four opponents there's obstacles there's whatever and there's by the way also DC difficulty adjust you start losing too much they give you like

Head Start so also here like what they're lying about in this creative not that the game Ty doesn't exist it just looks a lot worse like the production value in the creative is so much better than in the game yeah that's true that's Shadows if you mean that yeah okay and then we have this kind of like a hyper casual is type of yeah it's you know it's like these Gates you just that's iteration I mean it's yeah like these game like Creative Concepts are not bad I mean looks terrible but it's uh yeah it's I would maybe click on this yeah they have these emojis I mean emojis every every Chinese game is emojis in in creatives basically just great and then we have uh what do we have here so I was showing this oh well this this we have again like a choice merge this is

total top war like this completely completely which is I mean it's not bad like the concepts are nice but it's again like five Concepts all all the same but at least like something new I mean I've never seen this before uh which is nice it they definitely can like you can take inspiration from this and this was taken from their Peak day in 20 yeah yeah so they were running so why would why would they think like they stop it if they work before like I like still kind of think like there's some external Factor happening I think so as well I think so as well was another game launch around then that like swooped up a lot of the users or something just like something we're just forgetting that's really big I don't know call of dragons happen in between I think no I don't think like it's that like game so I think external in terms of like their company yeah yeah like something happened with the company or whatever who was managing the game or I don't know like earthquake or like I don't

know literally something like that that cre looks really good but yeah it looks yeah it looks kind of nice and then uh I mean so you have this hyper casual looking creativ obviously like this is what has the lowest CPI right but then like why the [ __ ] would you do these type of things it's just like really yeah it's just like even like this type of like like uh visual design in the in the hook 10 seconds of this with this like really well fantasy hero sex like yeah and sexist is like just like why like why would you even do that like this might have like way higher cpis than than the previous Concepts yeah it doesn't even help you on the hyper casual yeah and this is just like exactly what they they're doing nothing else right but again like this

like weird fantasy hero um creative conent then same the same uh uh creative concept just be different hero [Music] right and then uh one more it's like this is slightly different try another hook like really like this a better one like yeah I think yeah they could do way better than like this sexist [ __ ] but uh well choose I'm still guessing that even without the hook the previous creatives have having better CPI than I think so as well yeah yeah because it's just uh it's 3D way different and that's it basically right so this is just what what we have so to summarize oh you need a score yeah I need to give a score yeah yeah don't worry so what did we have here sexist hooks Hero Wars top war merge and attack

with choices snip yeah sexist Statics so I'm being very generous here it's like two out of 10 uh two because there's like different um merge Concepts that was that were quite interesting honestly it's just I don't like why people do this uh sexist hooks it's just it's first of all it's terrible and then second of all you have hyper casual looking game like why would you do that it doesn't make any sense so yeah there you go basically yeah for me it's like five out of 10 oh yeah I would expect like 15 [ __ ] if I know it's five I wouldn't even check this game I know like it's definitely for the effort because I would I would have guessed that this would be like the perfect product from UA side you know like you have all the creatives to hooks the prod action quality that looks like hyper you have the high LTV of Forex you have like

excellent transition all of these kind of things that I guess clicked in current age of the idfa Apocalypse U that Ma is going to get triggered so yeah seems to me like perfect choice but then as I said I'm guessing that we either don't know about some external factor that happened with the company or like if somebody knows that what we're talking about here and want to write us feel free to join our slack we're eagerly waiting for it because I think we're missing some kind of story behind this so in summary you don't need to spend AAA money to build a really beautiful game to make money you can do hyper casual in all game genres and the next supercell will be a hyper casual style like really bad quality you can use hyper casual level production quality you already know that you already know that never mind but the simplification of Forex is nice like just having five buildings in in Forex BAS is really good that's nice yeah okay

yeah I guess that's it and uh Remo you need to make an announcement where you going next week oh yeah yeah yeah yeah okay yeah I'm going yeah [ __ ] uh like basically the time you're hearing this I'm probably already in stul at the mobid dicton conference so what are you doing there yeah so I'm having it all hybrid casual so I'm going to also talk about this [ __ ] you're going to talk about Forex games well I hope for the sake of the audience no no no yeah we're going to we're going to talk about like lately what's been happening and like how I think people are going to jump on this hybrid casual let's say the newest sexy bandwagon that everybody wants to get into but nobody knows what what it actually means and yeah I will try to pretty much uh yeah figure it out together with people there what it actually means and like get some kind of terminology into it cool then PG PGC Helsinki we're not going yeah exactly too much stuff on our heads no we were

there basically every year in the last five years well except Corona obviously and it's just yeah we need to pick pick our battles I guess yeah but you can see me in another one of these ramblings later down the line in Cypress link conference on 14 of September o I'll be so Remo is uh he's doing the the Victory lap of all the all the conferences nice all right good uh thank you very much for listening please keep subscribing share the podcast with your industry friends colleagues dogs and cats they still love it they still love it and then uh if you have any comments please share your opinions and thoughts in the comment section on YouTube or write us on the on our slack where you should definitely join it's 300 people over there uh so uh yeah I guess thank you again until next time cheers oh see you

[Music] [Music] [Applause] [Music] food food guys need to run all right sure oh there's food yeah okay so you thought it's it's j yeah thank you that's great walking around SL streets of Slovakia saying do to everything thinking it means thank you turns out it's not sure okay [Music]