SSSnaker global launch & Habby metagame framework full UA, Creatives, GD & Admon review (#58)

[Music] let's go welcome everyone this is no [ __ ] gaming podcast two and a half gamer session number 58 we're sharing actionable insights dropping Knowledge from our day-to-day user acquisition game design and AD monetization jobs we're definitely not discussing the latest industry news but they having so much fun but let's not forget this is still 4 a.m. conference fashion VIP so let's not take it too seriously today we have Phillips Phillips [ __ ] who is Phillips who is Phillips than Felix sorry yeah or Flex so we have Felix FR yaku and myself M maybe we will have flip Phillips and and flex afterwards Jesus [ __ ] Christ yeah you want some some fun at the beginning we go my God 4 a.m. conference Vibe here we go yeah I can't even in the house yeah let's let's uh let's Flex um

on Diablo 4 characters so Felix now you can Flex I can't yeah exactly exactly that's what I thought but it's fine so we played uh with yob for you uh well Druid sucks so I won't play Druid Druid always sucked even Diablo 2 that was like completely broken Necromancer Builder like completely broken one you should see this guy he was like oh well I'm I more I can do whatever just wi one but I was Immortal everything everything's die everything dies immediately I like we were just running through sanctuary and like just corpses exploding and like who okay when do I I get to play a little bit more that really funny it was always like oh well you know i' I I had you know I saw this build and it's like ah Jesus Christ yeah it was really nice I would say um he's really hardcore yeah I'm super hardcore therefore I know that

what they're doing they're pretty much following the Lost Arc schedule there anyway so it's not anymore your usual Diablo single player RPG it's more like MMO RPG now so let's see where it takes them I guess they make it very very accessible which is great the game I guess needs a lot of balancing after we saw those broken let's see maybe you can hold that mic and then a little bit closer to your your mouth again that uh and then the last thing is I'm really curious how will they do their end game because the only thing I'm kind of very very let's say surprised that they uh tied their progression to level scaling of your character means that the content scales with you so you always he was explaining this to me I I said oh yeah yeah I get it Ser I'm cutting you off you have your [ __ ] game design time at the end of the show for a reason cutting into that right now yeah he went full systems and vectors on me like yeah yeah yeah yeah

now I understand man I have I had fck no [ __ ] idea what he was talking about for who whoever wants to get a like master class on this watch Crips video that's like hour of vectors and game design yeah [ __ ] is the Diablo YouTuber Guy original word for hardcore kill guy yeah yeah he quit his job to be an influencer nice now he plays hear stones for 10 years yeah well I'm yeah we'll see when we quit our jobs well I guess never so let's see uh let's see how it yeah for for now we can continue uh no GDC for us so uh yeah we're not jet likeed which is fine I've heard on and read some disturbing news about abuse and harassment uh during the the whole week which wasn't very very good experience I guess so I hope this uh this will kind of just remove from the industry by by itself I guess well let's see

no other no other things we can actually go into the the topic of today well maybe I was supposed to be a you know a flamboy and UA Flamingo session which I wanted to really go through all the like Hecks and tricks but the company called habby had a better idea so they launched a game called snaker so here we are Let's uh let's talking about it because here Mr hobby hobby okay hobby he Mr unfolding G P already wrote a few words about this game we already had a an interesting discussion on on LinkedIn so we got insult insulted and called names out of nowhere so it's really interesting uh situation but [ __ ] it uh yeah can you can you please enter the this game uh and by the way it's hard as [ __ ] actually at least for me so it's pretty much another one of those uh archero likes games from hubby for those when

following their pling framework uh is pretty much an iteration on snake iio I would say or actually I think in do SL somebody posted it's game called snaker that's even closer but actually there's the mechanic of the called snaker what what are you talking about yeah it's like a game on Steam actually ah yeah yeah I know like two years ago so so I I'm guessing like this this is probably like the inspiration behind those Studios that are then sending prototypes to hobby like with u the magic survival which is the original game behind vampire survivors and Survivor iio so I guess that could be a thing because what they're searching for is pretty much a very engaging Coop mechanic then they will then slot into their framework and make millions like they did with Survivor iio billions other games yeah wait wait wait before we get into that like billions millions and all that stuff honest question here guys okay so it's called snaker right because it has three s's do you think it's snaker like

right that's yeah I'm not calling it that like absolutely not what well you yeah oh it reminded me uh one interesting uh RI and Morty episode where there's the the snake Jazz snake Jazz snake Jazz yeah you can continue maybe there will be some snake Jazz yeah so they launched the game on March 18th and uh looking at the game it's getting super big as usual but we still don't it's not getting super big come on man okay it's not that big that Survivor it's in an exponential growth phase it has an experential go space yeah yeah we'll see it's nowhere near nowhere near the Survivor iio Global launch yeah yeah but but we'll see after a month where it where it goes I guess much more closely um the other thing is that uh it's pretty much as set following the metag game pattern that Hub uses and now I guess we can expect more games out of it because in the end

it was developed by another team that pretty much it's published only by HBY that's really important we'll get into it later yeah because also archero and Survivor iio was uh developed by Gorilla I think that's gor Studio okay gorilla and this is different yeah King Jan also was by a different Studio not gorilla one isn't gorilla like the internal one I have no idea man I don't know I don't know somebody from hubby wants to reach to us we'll be glad feel free to correct us as that that's how it works man that's how it works sending regards to Stefan yeah cheers all right let's go should I go all right yeah right snaker snaker okay so snaker admon analysis time uh am I a bad player or is this game just way too hard oh it's it's hard yeah I'm in world two and I keep getting stuck on like World 20 and it's a bit annoying to die on the same level like five times in a row and you have to play through 20 levels again on this level

you are really really I'm stuck on 30 now I'm stuck on 30 now to be honest but yeah I'm I'm in the world three it took me a few days but uh I passed it of course this Mr gach is already world [ __ ] million and played all the he is in the in the end game how how he raises a child and plays Diablo and gets that far in snaker is beyond me like I I can have seven seven of of his sons in my house and still do a lot of lot job I will give you one Katarina you will be [ __ ] all right so maybe we should rename the podcast two noobs and One Gamer but G but like don't you find yourself like you log in just to get like the quick gold and then just go out again and you don't do actually a session because yeah he plays all the [ __ ] time I'm pretty sure he already well you know what I I'm pretty sure he did uh he he was searching for builds and and combos of the of the attacks like which which stacks into each other

of course you did right no I didn't what I what I searched for were those was was there gift codes C you more resources okay sure all right all right enough game design talk more ad monetization talk so we all know that the Cornerstone of any healthy Game launch it's in his ad monetization strategy that's why ladies and gentlemen I get to go first on these analysis episodes we're most important shut up Remo at least at least you know there is a game you can actually talk about uh something exactly so Snickers snakers rewarded ad placements are very similar to survivor.io uh there are four rewarded ad placements in the store one is to open up a normal box on a 5H hour cool down maybe Remo you can actually show off these beautiful placements while I talk about it yep let me do that yeah um the second is to open a super box which is on a three-day cool down

which is great value for a rewarded ad uh the third well there you go technical issues Mr Mr game designer what what's happening share the share the [ __ ] window it's sharing but it's not loading it's not loading there we go there we go so go to the store yep and the third is for 20 gems and that's on a 2hour cool down and last but not least East there is a rewarded ad placement for gold hidden behind the gold free button when you first go in which I already got today yeah yeah I see like it's like it's Dynamic and this is important it's dynamic because doesn't clutter UI yeah I was going to say I love the gold placement the most probably because it's like uh yeah it basically conditions you to want to watch an ad because you get rewarded before and then you get like one to watch a rewarded out afterwards as well so it's perfect anyway nice outside of the stores uh there's also a rewarded add placement to revive

yourself when you die which you do a lot in this game in your in your case in your game in your case shut up no one asked you um and then also there's a rewarded to do quick earnings in the idol reward box that becomes visible after the first world which took me a while to get to like I think like all of the the OD placements are visible after World 2 no yeah all it comes after World 2 that's when you start seeing them all of them like the St always visible but then after World 2 is when the revive one comes and yeah yeah that's what I okay yeah so that's in total six rewarded ad placements in total uh so as part of the fou you can Max watch about four rewarded ads per session but past world two this grows to a plus six number of possible like rewarded ad watch so depending on the super box and how many sessions you play uh since we have no retention numbers it's a bit hard to handicap but I went with an

average of 3.5 Impressions per daily active users which I suspect grows to about 4 and a half after the second world because you do die a lot and you always do revive yourself uh the real question for me is actually how many users actually drop off because this game is actually quite hard uh also at the time of writing this snaker has had 900,000 downloads worldwide according to our favorite data tool so it's still a bit too early since we're breaking news uh to get a read on how many active users uh so I have to use downloads as a proxy so I put the da probably around somewhere between 700 to 750 775,000 users meaning that snaker if I take the ecpm I've seen in the last couple of days is currently making about 17 to 20K a day from ads the issue I guess with breaking news this early is

that IAP Revenue in our favorite data tool looks way off and the game looks like it's only made about 250k so far in iaps which puts ad Revenue at 68% of revenues which I think does not really pass the sniff test yeah man I'm quite confident about my numbers but the IAP numbers here look a bit too low yeah I was checking the numbers in in our second favorite data tool and it looks like it's making 120k a day ah that would make a lot more sense yeah yeah yeah okay so that would probably put us about uh in the last week then doing some quick maths here so that would no I don't have time for that but no I think probably about 15 to 20% that would be roughly amount that would expect way more yeah me either I would also expect way more you know do remember remember when I said it's uh on

Survivor iio it's like 50/50 and like no way it's not going to have I think it's going to be one of those moments again where I have to eat some Humble Pie when I actually get the daily active numbers out in like three weeks yeah man like there there they have so many other wed placements I would expect um these at least be like 40% or 30 to 40% also it's a bit hard to say also without the da numbers but yeah like what I said is like three and a half 3.5 to 4.5 like um ad watches per user probably within like in AD viewer rate of about 70% so right now it looks like it's from the numbers I'm seeing 70% of the revenue but if it's earning 120k a day that would mean since it's about 20K a day what's that like we said 120 or 220 12 120 no yeah so that would be about 20 to 30% of would be OD Revenue then numb are correct keep in mind if I get it right that you can multiple times

per day for an that I think like two times really yeah yeah you can you can okay depends on the session yeah depends if you're a noob like Felix or Phillips maybe Phillips is Phillips yeah Phillips is the new the noob yeah but but they could they could definitely take few more 100% that's what I wanted to discuss as well like one thing that when I was playing the game that kind of popped into my mind uh you know that like Rema when you open the first game you see that popup that shows like Rampage soup and basically if you click on it takes you directly to the store so there's a popup of exactly that that you're showing right now like I just thought from a game designer hat on like what type of I AP conversions do you think this actually leads to very good you think so yeah I think it's uh like if you if you would want to go against this with the doubling the idle currency like they had here yeah which they actually have the ad placement here it just not shown here but once per day you can you can pretty much not double but get two hour or

three hours no no you have two two quick earnings for two quick earnings and then add the quick earnings the ones that consume energy that's a mechanism for you to have a short session so you can immediately get rid of the energy and trade it for something because you don't have time to play it yeah but the ad placement is not really doubling it it's just again another in energy thing okay here's the thing right like me with my ad on hat on I was looking at that and if you actually put that placement as a welcome back like Idol like and make it Dynamic so if a user hasn't make made an IAP purchase basically then you start showing that instead like I was calculating uh where basically you can 2x your offline earnings I crunched the numbers and if you actually get an opt-in rate of 75% which is usually what you see on those on idle games at least when like doubling when you get back you basically get uh6 of a scent in adarp out from this one placement which after day 14 would mean about 10 cents in

overall player LTV that you would get from this one placement so I'm just wondering if you made a dynamic placement there do you think that would earn more than it's actually earning in the iip revenue the thing is that the gacha here and it's it's part of the metag game framework it's the main monetization driver here because you want to upgrade your gear and if you upgrade your gear you immediately jump up in in the current stages and move forward so my guess is that this is driving most of the revenue anyway because what else you would spend the gems on really like there's nothing else to it like this is the best thing especially now they have guaranteed epic um equipment in 10 like of course I did save up for this and like bought it this way yeah I didn't then I I I got [ __ ] nothing so yeah maybe maybe this other thing like currently it's not even show me this is now show me this but that's that's not for you like you know n no players you you yeah we're not there yet we're not there yet unfortun I'm glad I'm looped in with here yeah yeah yeah

I'm only in the world three but now they're showing me like there another feature that unfold later and now the game starts with this it doesn't start with the other thing so my guess is that this still drives more Revenue otherwise they would put the dynamic at at there anyway later down the line so I would I would go with like iips are more important for them and it wouldn't really make the cut there yeah but uh this Rampage suit is uh the same thing that was in the Survivor IO uh there some like s whatever chest they still have it there yeah and it's like oh well this is only for 24 hours and they keep you know keep it there for yeah for uh was since Friday yeah only for first week that got extended to like forever yeah to First forever yeah it's Bas on their design of the character inventory which is same in every game so it it goes really well with the kacha system and uh give me a second and I can show

it right here and we are there so same same design exactly it's almost like it's made by the same company oh yeah yeah almost but the game play isn't yeah anyway that BRS us on to the least least favorite part you know of anything you know the Floy UA session yeah actually actually this is definitely not as exciting as the global lch of Survivor IO so why because it's not even close to the scale of Survivor as I said and actually there's nothing new in terms of the U channels or creatives uh it's actually pretty basic at least that was my initial idea when I was starting to look into things soy that kind of changed afterwards uh but I'm always a little bit skeptical when I start doing this uh these reviews so let's check under the hood a little bit and as usual let's start with the with the geom mix so I mean it's

something interesting maybe here uh and I know yakob will agree the top Geo in terms of Revenue is [ __ ] Taiwan like how is that possible but still like okay maybe it's uh it's something interesting happening there but then we have us uh then we have Japan South Korea Hong Kong Vietnam and then after these Asian countries we have still one countries Germany France UK and Canada Usual Suspects Usual Suspects yeah exactly but I like I'm really surprised to see taian on first place honestly uh and even less the thing is like less installs more Revenue than us but then I was like okay well interesting uh this is like 95% or at least it was 95% uh Apple revenue and like five or 10% Android so uh and I I have to say there is a huge featuring on on iOS uh so I guess this is also like

part of the like why taian is so so high in up in the charts maybe this could be um changing um during the month well I'm expecting this to change actually well never mind and also everybody's bitching about iOS well there you go kind of not that at all uh but this is only iip so uh the game makes 120k as I said and in total from what I seen the you know second favorite data tool it's like 400 or 500 since launch but it could be still just a little bit it could be still skewed because this is just ramp up numbers which get to be kind of wrong a little bit but I was I checked how much money Survivor iio made after four days compared to this compared to this so Survivor iio all was already making 240k a day four days after global launch okay this game 120 there you go obviously it's not saying anything but

yeah maybe there isn't but let uh let's take a step back into the intellectual soft lunch of the game because this game was soft launch last year in what February 2022 maybe even before that because from what I found out thanks to our fans um that our favorite data tools they don't see the open Beta or any any other pre- uh production phase uh on Google Play So this you know every game can be in open Beta Testing uh and it's not visible in any of those tools so but yeah okay anyway like this is uh from 2022 February in it was s Flash in Italy France and Germany like what the [ __ ] seriously but okay uh nothing was happening pretty much the whole year until October 2022 uh where they ran some UA uh and added and UK into the mix made few hundred then again new build in

November same thing uh basically nothing unusual until January 2023 when they added Indonesia and Philippines I guess to do the like some tech tests I I assume and added Canada and Australia and then that's was like this is all like the with the UA all my assumptions but then I actually checked these UA channels in the in our favorite data tools and the favorite data tools said that they actually started running the UA in January and they were not running anything before so I guess it's was just sitting in the sitting in the in the in the store and then maybe they got some initial push from the the Google there or just random organic traffic nobody knows and then uh yeah so let's let's take a look at the creative so I'm going to share creatives uh which I uh downloaded from from the day favorite data Tool uh and then I'm going to just

showcase it actually in the in our new layout because I have in the slides and it's it kind of sucks I want to just showcase multiple on multiple creatives next to each other but oh my God so many different creatives so uh yeah let's actually open up this this presentation when you say so many creatives like usually how many do you have at this stage just so I know if it's well for this so I was I was looking into Facebook as Library they have already like 120 uh or maybe even more uh uh creatives in there and then there's like 70 pages in uh in our favorite data tool to each uh each Network so but that means how many different concepts you know because exactly it can be as big of a number with different formats different formats yes uh but this feels I mean I have usually when I when we are talking about the about these games um it's anything between like 10 to 20 uh 20 creative concepts for soft lunch game

for soft lunch and glob launch game afterwards this feels like it's like like 50 like it's really a lot so yeah there are so many different twists to the Creative Concepts they used uh which I really love because it's all all the things that I've been talking about all the time but let's also stop with one particular creative with with one influencer so I'm going to share this and then uh just for you guys to see uh and then I'm going to add this because it's way better uh let's see if we don't don't so they use a lot of ugc Concepts uh I can just here and there like different uh different people in I can I can show you this uh other ugc concept this is like real people talking about the game yeah okay what's happening you mean mobile at creative actors mobile at creatives no see okay so I will add the the music here but

then then this is this is really snake it's one of the most popular casual snake games it's actually really enjoyable unlike other games it doesn't have a bunch of ads to just randomly [ __ ] amazing maybe if my fuing internet works then I be able to see the the cre but I will show any the question is like who do you think like how do you think this was created how much money it's one of the most popular casual snake games it's actually really enjoyable unlike other games it doesn't have a bunch of ads to just randomly pop up and it's not pay to win it's actually really fun because it's really busy and you'll have to face waves of monsters but when you level up you'll get three skills to choose from that will make you fight a lot better that is really interesting because it tells me one other information I'll get back to it okay so we have this uh uh this person is in usual ugc type of

creative so first question floating head on the right side of the screen for those not seeing yes no no no it's it's going to be it's going to be in there uh don't worry so so how how much money do you think it's uh it's actually does this cost for for the company $1 4,862 23 cents exactly now the thing is this is [ __ ] AI so this is not the human the real human so this is uh yeah this is created for from the tool and how do I know it because I used it as well this is yeah this is fake uh so this is an AI so the face is also fake yeah yeah okay so the face is fake his motions are fake the voice is of course exist this person doesn't exist it's all so not like even the at creative actors got out of their job I have come for them and so there are there are so there's there are so many tools uh for this type of um well

people you can you can you know you can program NC NPCs yeah you can you can call them NPCs and to be honest like this is on pair in terms of the performance with the real people from the ugc I I used it on one game and it's maybe slightly even like outperforming the real people in the in the C so you can man there is like Bank of a lot of different different faces you can yeah you can use all you know you can be creative so yeah there you go and immediately when I saw this face I was like okay this is fake so I I sent it to to mate uh my motion designer that he was like yeah this is from the tool we use immediately okay this is this is genius also the you know the voice even better like it's it's [ __ ] funny how much how much will it squeeze the production cost of this not even cost it's it's about time okay you pay this yeah I mean you pay this fee for month I know it's like few a few bucks it's like hundreds of dollars not not expensive like maybe

like $200 I that's even like way more than we actually pay but you know this can be used and and produced like in what like 15 minutes 30 minutes it's amazing you just slap this I mean you can play around with the with the motion and the and speech and everything and but it's like you slap this on the on the video there you go one one new iteration amazing I love it this is again the same face but then again I'm going to show all of these great you see also the music there or hear the music character attribute after Awakening like I I saw these type of creatives with the explanation like what's going on in the Survivor IO creatives here it's even even better because it's combined with the like the AI phas but man it's yeah I love it I love it so

this is really interesting but then you have these like bass battles which I well it's what I called but they also have style yeah they also have the music I love this is this is great I I'm pretty sure like there's so many things happening at once this is actually what converts this works quite well so they use the same concept as Survivor but en them with um that was the previous version creative concept this is just like yeah like so many things happening yeah because it's also F their meta game anyway there you go and you have the snake iio you mentioned the creatives I I found those I actually found you have you know altered game playay I will that was altered gameplay you never of course it was aled gameplay yeah of course it was aled gameplay as well but it's there different type of altered gameplay but

yeah they they have hyper casual different um uh takes so they use Noob versus Pro but very different um uh scenario a lot of emojis I mean the creative work here and the production it's it's really outstanding I I must say it's I think it's uh based on the like the theme and like how the snaker looks like I would say it will have like really high cpis because of like visual theme but with this type of creatives I it's really good and they they also have this uh like classic gameplay videos uh so really like variety of of things that is happening actually on the uh on the creative side so yeah I was thinking like yeah this is very boring but then I opened up the fabr tool I was like yes this this is good this is very good so then uh we have the

the actual u channel mix so surprising things here a little bit as well uh what I found out also is that you know everybody's talking about this like you know you need to have different creatives on different channels yeah they they use again like everything everywhere it kind of works well uh and also they are running yeah easy they're running a lot of channels almost everything that's out there and even Twitter I was like who the [ __ ] gr's Twitter yeah I guess uh they run it as well at least from from the start uh and it looks like the biggest channel for them is iron Source it's not Tik Tok as with Survivor iio I was expecting Tik Tok yeah not really why yeah me too why because it works so well for them with survival iio I know but they had uh this uh you know uh behind behind the curtains deal with uh with Tik

Tok did they get a little slice of the pie you think let's call it that way no they they they used uh one of their um new products which was in the in the beta uh and it definitely helped them to get more eyeballs so basically habby was like yeah we'll commit to spending X if you push this a little bit organically as well and then we'll use your stupid tool or good tool it's not a stupid tool I'm sure it's good actually yeah it work pry well for them it worked pretty well I retracted what I said and it's a very good Channel and even now for me tkk Works quite well so yeah so it's iron source that was surprising uh but then then it's Google YouTube especially and then Unity so okay interesting uh but when we look more closely on Apple the biggest network is Google with YouTube inventory and then Apple and vangle I mean bungle really yeah I was I was surprised I was really surprised like so what the [ __ ] is happening in here because I wasn't expecting bangle

to see and I wasn't expecting to see like Google in the first place for iOS uh which never actually works that well but I'm pretty sure that this is going to change in a few weeks because you know first week you spent maybe with some like um underperforming channels as well and then you cut it off and then move the budget elsewhere so that might U that might be happening here as well and I will definitely look look into this in like in month uh so we can we can have an update on this even in the written form uh so in terms of the retention as I mentioned last uh last time uh when we were talking about the Frozen CD and the white out survival I want to I want to just mention the the retention numbers and this time I actually got um data from uh from game analytics version of their like benchmarks Plus tool where they have like data from like 100,000 games uh and

they said 1 billion players per month so let's see I wanted to com combine not combine compare Survivor iio retention Archer retention and also snaker retention but uh it's not it's not there yet so we need to we need to actually compare uh I have a feeling it's going to be a bit lower this game is way hard I think because was also super hard don't get me wrong it was but very new not like this yeah it was oh well it was hard uh but it was very new as well and I know there were some you know uh behind the curtains information they were actually getting like 60 plus retention on the day one now from the the favorite data tool it says 59% and day 7 27% and then uh day 30 11% day 904 arero is 45% of 4. super good which is nice right uh but Survivor iio it's 64 on day one

36 on day seven day 30 is 17 which is way better and then Day Day 90 was what like 6% let me Zoom this yeah I'm going to show it yeah 6.5% man that's [ __ ] amazing it's horribly High because then uh yeah we have the the data from game analytics and they W retention in the action category on iOS and I'm going to show all of these uh in the YouTube SE the YouTube I can even maybe share the screen uh so you can see it but it's really small actually uh yeah I will show you there so um in terms of like top two per percent of action games uh they are seeing day one around 50% and uh this day one retention is actually dropping from uh 50 to to 40 after the April 2020 too so it's it's decreasing overall uh let's see how that

goes and then we have the you know day seven on iOS which is 20% uh overall in in top two% then uh day 28 which is 10% for top two% of the like the best um games so if you you know compare all of these uh Hobby Games they are getting they are doing quite well across the action category yeah actually and there then we have the the day one retention on Android which is obviously lower somewhere around like 40 41% on day seven it looks like 13% and then day 28 is what yeah six five yeah around five so you know they have day 90 around 5% yeah we can yeah let's talk about scale in that case right so uh it's kind of easy or easier uh to scale H if you have these type of numbers right so uh yeah I want to say not

excited about the UA side is with Survivor iio in regards to scale although and I know yakob is really excited because he loves the game and Felix is excited because you know because they hat the game he hates the game but they they have pretty you know good amount of ads in the game but from from my perspective like the creative work and yeah Kudos heads off this is this is great and I know like we are always talking about Kingdom guard top war and their um approach to creatives and they are definitely far ahead but this is this is very good Twist on on multiple creative so I'm going to show show all of all of those and I usually download like five five concepts for this uh recording I have like 20 so yeah amazing amazing work I would say this is like a different approach to the same scenario here where you want to squeeze the CPI but still get midcore spend up the follow me yeah yeah yeah

there you go man you can all right we only have 10 minutes nice you have you have 15 for sure it's okay at least at least yeah so even more what to talk about today is not only the game itself but the whole framework that habby uses because we seen this as a pattern that's been going on from pretty much their successful Arch Hero game that they adopted into this kind of A playbook that they now run if but I'm not sure if we can trust uh the guy who has monetization uh and game design uh in the in the LinkedIn profile just wait a second anyway um so what's really interesting here is that uh AR archero King Jeran pumble snaker and Survivor IO are all the games on their portfolio that we're talking about they still have like penguin Isle and like all these other games that are not

following this formula my guess is from now on every every other game will be following this formula for those who don't know by the way keran is also exactly following this formula and it was launched pretty much at the same time as Survivor iio but nobody knows about it because it was super overshadowed no but it was launched before before the like a week before maybe more two weeks I would say yeah okay but super close to it and yeah yeah yeah yeah but the game sucks it's it's it's it's it's okay like I would say it's it's like probably the LTV cpf form didn't scale that that's the thing yeah yeah but what's the important thing here and if you're looking at the screen and you're now noticing that maybe these games looks kind of similar is that the framework that these guys use and uh it's really important because I would say this is an upgrade to the current industry pipeline of hyper casual Studios that's been running for what like 3 years four years five years don't know but now it's pretty much dying like Voodoo proclaimed that hyper casual is dead favorite story uh so what what

these guys are doing is that they're also they're publisher that that's the first thing to to note hubby is a publisher and for instance the snaker game is not developed by hubby is actually developed by EO games which I'm sure I butchered the name sorry for that uh and it's published by hubby uh therefore the thing is that they are working on the same premise that studios are sending pretty much prototypes or you know whatever you have there to them to test the kpi numbers and then they slot it into their metag game framework and actually what we can do we can look even into this game before the transformation so what you now see on the screen is snake Master stop doing the ASMR noise M I'm going to kill you snake Master which is uh the game that was the the original game before you can still play it and I I was able

to dig out some old APK build from November and it looks nothing like the game that you have on the right that is currently making looks exactly the same it looks really similar mate yeah yeah to to these two guys which are in line to be better game designers I guess uh so looking under the surface not only the surface yeah under the see what they talking about like just just look at the screen like do do you see any liveops monetization but I see the same gameplay I see the same gameplay of course I see the there's not even the same gam play there's not even the same gaml because if we look into the snake master and we actually okay just play a little bit what happens here is that there's even not even the rad Glide mechanic roadl mechanic being you selecting the three skills at the end of the chapter or like pretty much during the chapter this works completely different which means that the there's no Road Glide mechanics at all it's just the level so what I do

I just statically upgrade my weapons and then uh play the game and if I'm killing these guys I get are you playing this with the keyboard yeah oh [ __ ] sake of course you are in the world five why not why make things harder if you can make them easier not like that this okay life life lesson number one yeah yeah okay so the thing is that you see I'm getting bigger and bigger but I'm not selecting any more of those kind of skills here so what happens here is that you you just played at one level with think like a pretty much separate segment of a game play and afterwards you do that you pretty much finish the stage and you start all over again which means that this is the core gameplay of the game that they had before there's nothing like the usual hubby select one of three skills and the thing that you have that later it's not like that this is a different style of gameplay and even the whole upgrade and inventory we'll get to it a little bit later if I

don't get killed because it's I hope you get killed I hope you get killed too maybe I get killed because it's lagging like hell it is uh yeah so the thing is I I guess I got killed uh so so the thing is that I don't select any more skills anyway let's get killed because it's it's not point in this yeah yeah so the thing is that I don't select any any skills or anything like there's nothing Rog light to it's pretty much one stage that I need to go through and if I finish it I start again from scratch which is not the case in the metag game framework that Hub uses here whereas you cut these levels into like stages you see here this is like a separate stage this is now like a cluster of a chapter and now you know now you're talking like a normal human being no no no Mr vector and system and and and you you pretty much select your skills in the stage because that's how their metag game framework works because they turn everything and every one of these like hyper casual like core game into a r Glide action RPG that's their framework

if you see the inventory of this game it's just like one upgrade button with a static soft currency syn there's nothing to it if you go to Hubby game we got the usual six slot gacha that we get this nice offer Felix was talking about and we get a lot more money because what's here if you look into another feature that these guy have they also had it here but they unlock it somewhere I think world four Felix 26 yeah won't see anywhere close because this is another principle of these guys that they have this unfolding game play they try to mask the game to look like hyper casual therefore they're very very stingy on new features you get them very very slowly for instance Felix won't see them at all never so so so I'm I'm let's say I'm still don't have the snake egg thing it says chapter 11 o you know chapter 11 that would take like generations of Felix's to get there what chapter are you on now what chapter are you on five negative ncy on tour yeah ncy on

tour man of course so so they have very very strict philosophy behind how to focus the users's attention meaning that they first Focus only on the hyper casual core gameplay mastering it and only later down the line they start slapping features on top of it and on the side of the UI as you see here where there's all the battle passes achievements subscriptions monetization liveops everything and this is coming from their metag game framework every single one of hobby games has that if you put Survivor side by side beside it we can see the same icons same thing everything's there yeah so this is working very well for them uh I guess this is the way to pretty much be able to keep up with a very fast release frequency not only by testing all the games before committing to them and sloting them into their metag game framework but after they test it out they out of the bat know how the you know roas and everything will kind of behave with that game if they can hit the CPI and the only thing is if they

can hit the CPI is based on marketing test on the previous original game which they will test like hell like mat showed before with AI creatives and everything by the way they also have the snake uh the original snake IO gameplay implemented here in the trials so it's not fish so is HBY the new voodoo yeah this sounds like new voodoo to me like this sounds like the hybrid casual formula to me anyway voo that's like come on man that better man the best thing is that their framework my guess is that their framework is like old game compatible so if they update some new things into it it can be updated across the whole portfolio so that I guess it's like very very if they add some some new feature in this framework and then they like okay update everything then it will pop up in survival iio yeah exactly like know monetization we're talking about like the shop and everything like the gacha feature that they have here is exactly the same yeah I know yeah even the artwork looks similar like yeah

yeah so and by the way the like this got back to me like some of the music assets the Survivor I is same in snaker exact same sounds exact same music but this is like this is super [ __ ] efficient like why would you that's the thing efficiency it's only about efficiency because if you look at the other games which is the pball and kinger run that mat said it's so shitty unfortunately it didn't went really well it it like went up and then went down and that's it for the game and this is the thing that this is part of that happy formula they'll try to get as much of these out on the market as fast as possible and you know do the preparation test the CPI get the core game play slot it into framework try to pump it up and if it catches then it goes up like Survivor iio if not then see you on the next game yeah see in snaker so my guess is that currently like do we have what like we have like end of March my guess is that they could release potentially two more games this

year this way yeah with with like being able to cut through like 10 more of these prototypes or 15 don't know what's how how many studios they were why why two more games now and not last year because they already launched Survivor oh well they launched pball and K and Survivor iio okay so it's three games okay yeah if if they can keep up with three games like this and one of them being survival iio that's great that's like and even if it's if it's well only in this scale it's [ __ ] one biggest game launches last year only yeah yeah it's way it's amazing it's amazing say like and and this is the the best thing for me that the that they make it so modular and like the whole thing the design and everything it's done so well that it fits fits very well and don't get me wrong they I guess they didn't choose Rog Glide as as their like go-to game genre that they're pretty much transforming every other game too because it's very forgiving and it's very forgiving because in R Glide games you progress just by being stuck like if

you're stuck like Felix here and he would keep coming every day to get his ass kicked he will still get resources and eventually he get to upgrade his character and he will get over content he wasn't able to get through anyway constellation prize yeah yeah exactly I got I got a medal for finishing so his stats will grow so high his HP because the scaling of the whole game is Just HP and damage nothing to it it just grows up grows up grows up and and therefore like just by upgrading it you go over it like you know this is not Dark Souls slamming your head over some boss that you cannot get through so yeah that that's really good and uh yeah I'm really looking forward how this one goes forward I would say as I said like I expecting two more games to be released from HBY this year um maybe more let's see uh yeah unfortunately I don't expect this to get as big as Survivor iio based on the initial numbers but let's see still like if they can get like 1 third of Survivor IR Revenue still super good pretty good success yeah I get the

profitability or efficiency on this project is like out of the window definitely and then uh yeah I guess we'll see because my other question is that why is nobody else following them in this Playbook before why all the other hyper casual Studios that were like you know proclaiming the G they're going to switch to hybrid casual never done this yeah because it's not not that easy right easy this type of framework even I I I know that yeah Jesus my guess is that that probably somebody will take on this after like not not even after but maybe this already in the works for someone yeah for sure that that they're doing this kind of framework and maybe also trying to convert their prototypes into something that's compatible to their framework and then like choose some kind of meta game that going to go around it and that's it we'll see I think uh say games already said that they're switching to hybrid casual or trying to get more into midcore IP driven games yeah it looks like that

their revenues is climbing up quite nicely and they they just released some some other merge to defense game so we need to look into that as well in yeah yeah that's I guess like one of the closest one here in the western part that's trying to get on this but I guess more and more Studios will get onto this Playbook because it's it's just super efficient like I I don't I don't think so you can get around the efficiency this way because you're still having the hyper casual pip planine you just upgraded it with like differentation framework yeah yeah nice okay I guess the is that it is that it nice uh yeah thanks uh for uh sharing the the screen as well it was really good I love it and apparently people love that as well so I'll keep doing that uh and thanks for listening please keep subscribing uh our subscriber count is increasing as well very nice l so please keep doing that share the podcast with your industry friends uh family

dogs and cats yeah and by the way if you have any games that you think are worth looking at feel free to sh shoot it our way as a lot of people been doing and we're very grateful for that yeah Special shout out to to yesper he's he's doing that on a regular basis and uh man you're amazing thank you very much so yeah uh thank you keep subscribing sharing uh with your friends as well and then see you next time bye-bye bye y [Music]