ChinaJoy 2024 POV: WeChat mini-games, the speed of game development & Impressive market growth

days everything is net 60 I'm like what do you mean how does it work in China and it's like St like day one but you get it all paid out in UA credits yes oh yeah so the if there is an interesting trending in uh game on wi at mini games and which jet kind of sees this then it can support this game with 400k uh UA UA budget instantly [Music] this is a no gaming show where we talk about games and their revenue in great detail powered by our ad monetization game design and user acquisition Triple Threat expertise welcome to the two and a half Gamers the unfiltered truth served with a side of giggles

let's not forget this is a 400 a.m. conference discussion Vibe so let's not take it too seriously tune in now and stay two and a half steps ahead of the gaming industry now you can think now you can s welome to the Jungle it's not not Welcome to the Jungle or something else and then he says randomly at some point he's like hippo hi well not Welcome to the Jungle but welcome to to and have Gamers um lat this episode we are going to talk about China oh because we just came back from China my name is mat I'm Felix braberg and I'm and we are your hosts so okay so we just came back from China actually yesterday it was an very interesting very very interesting uh few days because it was in and out Wednesday morning in Saturday morning out so and

we learned so much uh or so many different uh things and absolutely amazing Insight so first of all kudos to Heaven from Century games for hosting us and ah for the amazing time we have uh we had there also David and Colin thanks for for the day two um and all the information and we we met so many new uh new people amazing people and we are definitely going to go back so we're going to talk about the China Joy experience we at mini games and some insights we kind of got from all the discussions we had also I think I G gained like five kilos because we we were eating basically everything didn't eat us the food was so great very good it's amazing yeah good in this episode I think but you know spoiler alert China's like a different country oh W different world

no but all seriousness like I I was not expected to be as blown away as I was but yeah I was pretty blown away I mean I was blown away by the fact that not so many foreigners were there that was just like an absolute next to zero basically yeah very absolute surprise and whoever wasn't there this year guys you should definitely be there next year it's absolutely worth it absolutely worth it uh from again food but also the gaming companies and like whatever you can you can actually find out in China that I I think like half of the gaming industry doesn't even know in us or in Europe so so like I think this like China put this saying a little bit further like if you're thinking about the game there is 10 10 companies already working working on already having soft lunch as a protot yeah like or or so 10 10 10 companies in

Europe have like working on it like there is 10 companies already having life build at least on beach many games in China it's like absolutely true absolutely true Jesus Christ yeah the numbers are just bigger bigger than anyone we see because we just don't see those numbers of s of tower here I mean makes a lot of sense H we were talking about oh by the way thanks thank sensor for having us on uh at your event uh we heard a good feedback and also thank you very much up here for having uh me and the guys as well on the at your event as well it was amazing it's pleasure uh to meeting you and all the all the people there uh and also Tom fromer Tower said that they're not even trying to estimate all the all the revenues from all the different stores from from Google or Android in China Androids Andro it's just like it's it's impossible close to Impossible also what is interesting is weed has rankings on

the IAA which is in up ads revenues um estimates which that really broke my heart because I don't have a party trick in China it's just there they have a ranking for IAP like sales never ranking for ad sales so it's like it's just there yeah it's like three charts there because one is based on like engagement or daily active users if I go that right or downloads remember which was it then the grossing IP revenue and then basically grossing get Revenue yeah since since we're talking numbers a bit like we pulled it up before the show maybe REM you can pull up the article but uh we looked up before so China right now uh this year is going to be about 40 billion uh this year in the in Revenue in the gaming Market to put that in perspective the US uh gaming Market in 2024 is projected to be about 60 so you know China's definitely catching up in terms of overall size and uh the size in terms of the overall gamers is uh

pretty much double the US population yeah yeah so it was like plus 20 billion uh US dollars if you recount it from uan and its increase of 2.08% of it stable growth and the number of users were 674 million yeah slight increase like slight increase by seeing a new record basically yeah so you can see the charts here it's just giant um it is yeah what's there let's go through the categories if you scroll down you to highlight like which categories the Chinese gaming Market mainly consists of believe the biggest one was strategy oh Sherlock uh everybody said uh basically we discussed that anything we like they know how to do Forex games and we kind of figured that out yeah straty still accounts for the highest portion 3G which means forace way they call it

SLG in China yeah different not Forex uh role playing accounts for 10% something significant year or in Decline actually shooting which previously accounted for relatively High portion or fell to 6.6 7.6% and ler schedual I guess no I guess it means schedual to 3.9% you don't really see casual games in China that much not yet at least the revenue above the two categor or of the products Dro significantly so the interesting thing is like the the the gaming Market is very split differently compared to the West as well because nearly 75% of the market is just mobile games right so it's even heavy more heavily T like slit what you call like slid the what's it called weighted towards mobile games that in the west yeah yeah yeah um if I get was that word skewed was the word sorry I've been on a I've been on a hell of a journey from China

the proportion of client games which I guess means PC games in this article it's 22.9% and web games continues to shink accounting for 1. 159% I think uh this goes back to the discussion we had about like why are Europe and the US good in casual games versus um China and South Korea basically good or kind of more complex players or players looking for more complex games are just Forex RPGs or M bus because of the history right yeah yeah it's pretty much like where these Gamers were starting their childhood games and what were the kind of traditions there that brings us maybe to mini games can we do a little intro what we chat mini games are and then basically just show a bit of what we saw because I think that's what what amazed me the most right yeah stop stop stop stop stop stop which from here yes this is the like three years of the yeah yeah

yeah so 16.6 billion you won which is uh like I can divided eight I guess anyway it was kind of growing in the last three years 2.3 let's say billion 2.3 billion 2.2 billion which is up by 60% games are growing so WeChat mini so WeChat mini games for those who don't know is basically games that you download inside of WeChat so it's not an app no downlo no download just play you click from from the do ad which is their version of Tik Tok yeah and you know that reminds me good old HTML 5 or instant games which kind of doesn't They Don't Really Work in the in the west but me and were discussing this like the the reason it didn't really

work in the west west was the 50 megabyte download limit right like they couldn't be bigger than 50 megabytes right yeah yeah yeah I remember the like good old days when you when this like instant games or HTML 5 games started on Facebook and it was just like hyper casual games there build anything more than 50 Max so what can you build you know hyper casual yeah hey come ony she's like what happened why are you so rude rude yeah I was there back then man you know how hard was to do these things because there was no Discovery nothing like hyper casual is much more advanced than you know under hyper casual back in 2017 yeah absolutely can you show a mini game so we can show the viewers where actually is mini game in this is absolutely not not the mini game like there is white out survival which is zero mini game it's exactly the same game as you can you can download on iPhone or Android it's the same

thing please call it mini game cuz it's I don't know why mini but it's definitely not mini Yeah so basically on left side of the screen you see uh a game that's reminding us of we are War yeah but this is what this is a is a goose yeah it's a goose I don't know some Chinese version it's exactly the same game but it's change the characters yeah I'm going to send this to samur tomorrow and be like yo y look what's going on in China yeah by the way there is a clone yeah and then on the right side there's basically how it looks as white out which is pretty much the same game like it's exactly the same game it's just in Chinese full 3D animation everything do you know do you know how is this possible because in China the technology is not a problem yeah as we learned that was one our favorite quotes that we learned yeah that's the answer like oh my God and then if you think about it it's kind of true yeah no but

you're actually yeah you download or like kind of get the first 50 and then you play the game and then you download on on the background the next 600 megabytes or whatever was was it yeah also look uh it was kind of we thought at least in the past that you need well you don't need ISBN uh which is the license in China to actually publish a game but you found out that you need actually one if you want to make IP Revenue if you don't want to make IP Revenue meaning that the game is completely add driven you don't need ispn meaning the registry number from Chinese Ministry for games also an interesting Al also interesting gray area which is if you don't have one you can rent one which is a gray area is AB very very very gray area but you know like if you don't get caught then you're fine which you absolutely get will get caught and

at some point because you know it's a nice way how to destroy your competitors exactly so you could claim that uh if you have an ISBN which generally takes a year to apply for and get which you can't get but it will take a year but essentially if you rent it out to a friend a family a comrad yeah any basically uh then essentially if you do an update and you just claim it's a normal game update completely different game then it's kind of within the rules of law so it's within a gray area but then if that game starts making money and a competitor gets angry they usually just tell on you so then you have to yeah battle it out with the States you can get pretty pretty big problem but you know yeah well you need to do what you need to do I guess basically DDR uh if people think that these are just random mini games or equivalents of you know hyper casuals from 2020 it's definitely not are pretty much fully fledged games same the entire

App Store like all the sizes yeah it's just that it works on a way that you need to download something instant which is within the 50 Max kind of instant package and then it downloads the rest you see as I was playing it it was also loading there was a loading bar a little bit for those who called it so the game is just very very optimized let's call it how can you play these mini games well you can't if you don't if you don't have the Chinese version of V you Cann see the charts if you don't have the Chinese version of the weat yes you can only when someone is someone links it to you yeah yeah yeah which is I mean again can can't obviously maybe if you had do the Chinese Tik Tok and you get the ad you could also you well so you know you need to you need to have a Chinese VPN in order to work all all this I'm don't using VPN this is normal you are not using but for uh for different things to

have there like the whole mini games and rankings and everything and do in basically you need you need to be in China yes I was I had like I just had a discussion today with some of our new friends on the podcast okay so maybe it's not so it's not that it's not that easy so our also like our um publishing activities in China will need to have some work ons let's call it that way but I want on top of it don't worry what else can we say about these mini games and China's how can I put it a bit more porous way of dealing with data and how metrics are shared with everyone in the industry because I think that was struck me the most because pretty much what everyone said that was you know like high up in a gaming company that was spoke to us quite a lot is that everyone knows everyone data everyone knows the cpis the retention

likei Roi everything yeah during the discussion just yet the our friend like she just pulled the the screen like hey are these your numbers like yeah pretty much so it's it's quite interesting basically like from my understanding at least was that the account managers that work at the advertising networks in China are a bit more liberal with what they share than what they do in the west so yeah everyone knows everyone's data yeah like few few hours basically few hours yeah which kind of is interesting because then also there are like few few channels that um you can see and get the the actual the the latest rankings and uh and there are also vet groups where you can get like tens of articles like these that we were just quoting from the

numbers from like which games are just released basically everything which gives you very big advantage in terms of what's working what's not working what's published what's not published and also I was reading like few interesting case studies um about like combination of different genres how and what is uh trending now so it's an absolutely amazing source of uh of knowledge and also what struck me is like the pace which everything is done in China is really quick and then one CMO we were talking to such a insightful conversation he was basically complaining how the velocity of doing anything in the west is slow and I was like what do you mean with that and he's just like well it's like you know I I get in 30 days and then like advertising Revenue 30 days 40 days 60 days everything is net 60 I'm like what do you mean how does it work in China and it's like stay like day one but you get

it all paid out in UA credits yes oh yeah yeah so the if there is an interesting trending and uh game on the W mini games and wiet kind of sees this then it can support this game with 400k uh UA UA budget instantly and then basically after you get the revenue um but you your Phil just mention mentioned you need to get the revenue well you need to wait for that Revenue invest like for 30 days here just one click and it's immediately transferred to your UA account and you can spend it I mean it makes so much sense like brilant wow like removes all the bureaucracy immediately and just ches for grow growing and just spending that money immediately it's like that gives you such a big edch I've heard of some mediation providers doing similar stuff like paying Upfront for estimated

revenues and stuff like that but it's still like you need a lot of data before that's possible and then it's like you know a lot of deal making and a lot it's not like a press a button it's it's quite cool yeah very cool oh what do we have here REM is showing a slideshow of what yeah this pretty much our tour as we are going like asess we going this is the meta event we were there pretty big one but they has they had U also English translator in your ears machines which wasn't working for me but it was working for okay for me so that was nice that's all that matters I know yeah I know also met executive dinner we're not going to show all the pictures and videos not going to be pictures of our whole holiday wait wait I was on a holiday the holiday man maybe for you maybe for you but for me I was working like I I I landed few other interesting pictures that you see here is pretty

much um yeah a lot of there's giant interest in China that people want to know more about Western games actually especially Monopoly go as you see here on the slide where it was saying like how Monopoly go is pretty much taking a firm hold in the Western Market um oh whatever this is I translated these for you man you should have in what Yep this is the translated one so it's there monopo go complet in Game of food hold and lead the best selling list in the let's say uh yeah and overse original competitive metrics of China mobile games in 2023 Miho Contin strong performance at the point increased by 180% I guess yeah there was also the century games you just translated quite shitty but what basically this means that you see the biggest kind of a players from China in the West Mark being mihoyo Century Games Arena and 10

cent how much that 10 cent is super sell though you think yeah counted here I don't think so consider this like just like maybe Chinese games from don't know yeah there's a few more slides there which is like uh the trend of Japan mobile top games which is still Monster Strike pretty Derby being the second one which we can't wait to review As It Gets the West oh yeah I can't wait to talk about horse CS uh the situation CH overse had prob in some other countries such as us Japan and Korea where you see white out survival being top in US Legend of mushroom being top in Japan and Korea and Korea as well and the last thing is uh Hong Kong maau and Thailand the interesting region there is region but like typical entrance here like you see like uh 37 games

Forex Japan being dominated by mihoyo so honai genin and K Nik and white out survival being in Korea re let me let me pause you right there and like from this whole trip what was the thing that shocked you the most or impressed you the most Chu me the most impressed like it definitely impressed me the whole QR code nature of everything we didn't see any cash literally absolutely zero Zer zero money yeah no no Bank notes nothing everything is done with QR codes every thing except for the bank notes that you made me get out because basically it was to be on the safe side and then I had to exchange him back and I lost like 80 in the exchange rate like 80 yes like yeah not 80 like eight exactly come on yeah like it's super convenient it's I must say that it's super convenient it's super convenient to you know pay for parking ticket right at the entrance with just like scanning a QR code click click that's it no like machine whatever cards nothing you just

walk in everything's kind of automated that that was really surprising and the other surprising you know what was surprising like people working 20 20 hours a day oh yeah yeah we were we were we were going to restaurant at uh something like between 8 to 9 p.m. and there's like so many people in the streets like what's happening like people are going back from what people really work 996 like it's not a myth it's yeah yeah is yeah it's really like that but but they they start at 10 keep in mind that 10 yeah 10 n 10 n it's not like that 1096 yeah yeah so that's there um we talk about this one the same one yeah and we talk about this one yeah there we go so we can continue here perfect yeah few photos of the actual Expo so uh the thing we got is let's say the the knowledge we got is that it's actually shrinking because the CH the ch conference is shrinking the China gaming

Market is growing at 2% compounded Expo area let's let's say Expo area is shrinking because the business there actually um B2B and b2c four and four uh there were 13 holes B2B used to have five holes it only had two holes Now consume area was also only four holes and then for more holes which was like consumer like uh I don't even how to call it like stuff like computers hardware and or something it wasur car Razer Razer as a as a brand and whatever else LG Sony all these even cars but I would say cars the size of it it was something like 20% smaller than gamescon but still very massive how the you count it 20% like how how that number just pop up in my head yeah it's like my my meter is going

[Music] off I estimated it it's about 16% smaller than no no no he 17.82% hey hey hey I'm the exact number guy can you take my gimmick let's sorry sorry sorry so this is how it actually looks like pretty much very similar to business area at Gamescom you just walk around around a lot of STS that uh yeah that's gry M fix trying to get didn't get breakfast just ma little sleep and no food huh sheez don't even start I'm I'm not gonna because I know what happens it's not starting let's skip this part this part nobody cares about this part but if you and if you care please ask on in our select Channel I will gladly tell you what happened ask Mara what he thinks about pressure I don't keep Fu about just so that was the usual in the business like you could see just like

whatever a lot of payment companies this year companies definitely a lot of these like u i don't even what those like technology companies S I would guess so I would guess lot of these I don't even know can we get to the singing line please the singing no no no wait wait wait this is just you know like this is still business area this is still business vks yeah yeah yeah where we go this is leing business area yeah and this is the actual consumer area so it was super packed I had to say it's definitely more packed than it than it's usually at games 20% on the size of games 20% yeah maybe we don't go over the weekends we go new that's what I would say also the games come we usually do what like the the business day no like the media day media they don't have media day so you can cheat with being a developer going into the Expo work consumers are not there you can these things which is on Friday

I think like on Saturday it was even more I there's like a lot um the thing was I would say pretty good like uh some very interesting stuff yeah this is one of the more interesting stuff we saw please where's the sound the sound we need the sound we need the sound stop just wanted to show like how it actually looks and then we can get the extra the sound button right down there oh I need to share with the sound look I need to share with the sound exactly dear listeners uh this was the biggest what moment uh in my life I think and we actually found the video on Billy Billy where which is YouTube version of YouTube but not really yeah where there's this is this the we found out this is the very famous singer singer yeah exactly and he was literally

singing something mat jungle and it's actually a Forex game whoever is listening please you just go to YouTube just to have a vuck moment as we we had because this is a for game yeah this a Forex game with animals so I've had I've had time to digest this so basically it's a Forex game that came out and they used this guy dressed them up in Jungle attire and then they had a bunch of people dancing singing this song and it was amazing and also we saw a lot of Chinese uh ladies dancing on the stage because that's how it's done in China say like Asian traditional basically you don't see these things anymore wait wait wait was the part [Music]

[Music] yeah I think he's like a Tom Jones of China yeah something like that yeah like a Tom Jones in China very famous older gentleman [Music] yes okay so this if you pause that like so this would be if the same if Tom Jones was singing for the launch of Monopoly go oh no no no one of this was the same as Tom Jones would be singing for the lunch of squad Busters I would say oh not even Squad Busters I I would think like total battle instead because it's Forex total battle because that's what that's what it is back to the venue you could also have the the dancing girls on in it basically yeah moving on uh lots of these like super high production boots there this was aurine one of my

favorites blizzard was there because finally blizzard reunited with ntis yeah so after six months of not being a part now of not being able to publish games so now's everything good there uh yeah lots of kind of usual Chinese friends were there or IPS this was this was like very interesting where there's like one one lady on one side screaming and then across the street there was a Heartstone lady opening AA packs and people standing with signs yeah people standing with signs you don't have only signs but you have people with signs also you know what was interesting if I not sure if you have it there but the the ladies versus ladies valerant match ah kind story oh Val is so it's like five or 5v5 or 4v4 I yeah there was like it's pretty much like orts kind of championships were played in the background of the yeah super cool like zero emotions like absolute poker races super super focused man that's

what yeah of course I saw that pretty much but the Expo was like very very nice I would say yeah you look like a child in the Disneyland yeah yeah yeah pretty much I just laugh with these gaming Expos they're like so good it's great you see it's great I think I have a better photo somewhere yeah this was the bant yeah this was the supercell stand actually giant line they follow the same same setup These Boots as the ones on games con that you have like giant lines and if you get there you get to play the game or something do something actually for like 10 minutes and then they give you merch or some reward so I found the the plush cat there at the China construction bank so I wanted to have it and they said oh we can't because you're a foreigner so we can't give it to you he's not lying broke my heart broke yeah I mean yes yeah for for those who who

who Wonder like how dungeon fighter dungeon and fighter looks this is how it looks this is the game where where do you have the 15 skills on the right hand side that you need to this is yeah they were playing oh by the way there was the Taxi Driver Taxi Driver that wasla we went into a taxi by the way everything's electric like 50 50% of cars are electric like you couldn't even hear cars or motorcycles are just like super silent they're electric and we got into this taxi and then the guy literally had his tablet which had the old version of dungeon and fighter on autop plate and it was just like giant cluster of numbers and partical effects also uh there was a Tesla and it was just like I don't know like what's like all the figurines everywhere just glued like figurine in the yeah I like what what's happening what's

is happening yeah yeah yeah that that was pretty sural but yeah dungeon and fighter is like super super strong they had giant presence there we heard that it make even more money that the one that you see being officially said and actually way more in the west because yeah like here's a rule of thumb for any of you listeners whenever you hear any Western Outlet say anything about any game making anything in China just at least double it like least at least or or 32 exit like it's just like it's just nowhere near what you think it's just so much bigger so yeah that's what we heard yeah continuing on the Expo yeah we see also some like very interesting of clums like this arm of Doom you know you know like it was explained like on on WE mini games or in Gina like the games have I mean terrible names which are not terrible are very basic names and sometimes it's really

not able to translate this to English English end up with armored of Doom armored I was like yeah how does make sense it's like yeah World of Tanks basically yeah yeah but as I said like the Expo was very very good that was super nice some like this is AFK Journey stand like super super high waiting for the L party to get but it like an hour line which we didn't get like go this is p world for those who don't remember so they also have a pretty big presence big boot there also we saw the hell divers one and no one wanted to go in the Ubisoft St the only one that didn't have a line that was very very sad sad oh my God they were asking us to come in it's the only one anti it was yeah like nobody was there

nobody all the a giant Lon there was Lady asking us to go to this one I'm going to play in Ubisoft yeah sorry guys yeah this was amazing statue of Hell D there was PlayStation area I think yeah it's all all people queuing for like PlayStation games and then yeah I think when did when did you take these all these pictures man see like you were just going like grandpy old grandmother uh I mean I'm I'm not insulting you so off I'm just asking a simple question uh yeah pretty much by the way there's gas gas everywhere I think this physical G Felix photo bombing my gacha documentation oh man whoever that guy is he's so funny so so keep in mind so these were the gacha machines for cash and later down the line show you also gacha machines for QR codes actually so so you saw cash yeah there was also like this

like merch area which is not about like you buying the merch but companies making the merch and presenting it themselves too bad we didn't really meet Ryan rolds and Hugh Jackman Ryan RS Hugh Jackman there promoting the movie uh taking picture next to our shangrilla hotel like on on that like one of the roofs one of the roofs that we are just walking walking by yeah well next time next um yeah we end it there I think by the way these these these YouTubers there was also bil is bil don't have YouTube yeah they pretty much girls um standing in front of like mobile phone stands and you could just see the streams it's like so surreal if you see like many of them at one SP yeah the same yeah U that's my figurines we see your figurines these are the QR code gas code you see like the the the items in it and you you know go byy QR code pay them by QR codes and

this was the actual like outside of the Expo where you could see like the holes are pretty much massive and it would go into this like um triangle basically and all of them are just like full full full of people i' say the food was better than Gamescom for sure oh yeah I mean by the way this was an interesting thing that we got shown where there was a mini a yeah live on where people here it's pretty much like people are buying soldiers for either blue side or red side and you see it live as they're battling basically and there is also like a guy in the background kind of telling them or just kind of yeah not telling them what to do but encouraging them yeah like a game master pretty much yeah yeah yeah and and the if you ask how many people are watching this is like 23 people got all so which is not a lot but

uh apparently there's like thousands of these games uh actually live at the same time so this could be like one of the new waves coming in which is already kind of is man like we can see this on we could see this on Tik Tok or or whatever you mentioned also on Twitch that the whole twitch was playing Pokemon yeah but you cannot paint these things and make them like a actual oh yeah yeah that's true because this was concept this is this is happening there already yeah but that's but you didn't say that this is actually like P in to to the game master or whoever has the whoever runs the yeah host the game like you're paying him yeah so but so you battle against the other opponent yeah one side versus the other we'll see pretty much chat games so but looks pretty polished um yeah I think this is the last one very good Skyline what did what impressed you the most M uh I think the the the dinner we had with Stan from uh top for fun and

the guys from Legend of mushroom and then Heaven obviously from Century games yeah we got shown some of the games Legend of yeah so Legend of M guys uh the joined games are coming up with few new games and oh my God crazy yeah they're definitely not a one trick pony yeah yeah yeah they know what they're doing um I think the the the that was the best discussion we had with Stan like about um the the dopamine and then the how creatives Works basically like the onboarding works and like they they have very very different like Paradigm mindset how to approach these things compared to Western mindset I would say oh yeah yeah so that that was very interesting discussion and and they're just like yeah they have a lot of people in their creative teams everybody has off creative people and the thing they they create the all these like produce all these creatives in their own engine rather than just you know after effect Unreal Engine yeah

it's okay unreal but that kind of gives you interesting information about like where the creative production is going right away and you can see it with but the thing right because I don't think so they consider creative people to be only new artists and because in order to do these things you literally need programmers and stuff to like maintain the unreal simulation for the Creator we had the discussion uh with the sons of lady uh she also said look like in China UA and the creative person is the most earning position it's like yeah yeah most most best paid position best paid position in China because it's super super important game industry China in the game industry China so if you're UA and China like you're god basically it's like but it's you the China yeah yeah yeah all already fill the papers already fill the papers yeah oh like that was just like because like it's so true it's so true when I started working with Century games on the

creative side like then I asked like okay so how many creatives you already different concepts you already had you can think about yeah all of them exactly it's like hey can I like like play is buying like all the Impressions like on Facebook hey can I get some Impressions how how many all of them so this is exactly the same thing they had like 500 different concepts already like with like so many variations so that was just like this is how how how it is in in China and the UA and creatives it's just like man can't even compete I guess the only thing they can't do in China is puzzle games or speak English they can I guess like but they're still learning because of the genres kind of Origins we talk about that they're primarily RPG strategy MMO RPG kind of grew up with so therefore they have much more expertise in that and also know they know the the players a little bit better we try to explain like how we play in the west are not you know used to anything which is more

complex because if it's more complex they will just turn immediately I think the other thing that like needs to be said really is that people in the west when they complain that they get copied or like that somebody's copied they like like this is like completely different level in China like by talking to people there I think people don't understand how hard it is actually for Chinese people or Chinese companies to make it in China in ch yeah yeah much harder than overall Western Market yeah because imagine that people are coping your games on velocity of hyper casual games but those are actually midcore games prod the same speed yeah the thing is that you launch a game in two hours big companies have the your numbers and they're like ah okay yeah and they're their teams to to code in another third hour yeah and then like month they have the Prototype easy easy as that like you you can't even can't even see this in in

invest at all at all like we could see it pretty much like again we're talking all the time about the Christmas prophecy of doodle magic like we've seen so many iterations on Doodle magic during the trip like so many and already plus ones plus ones not the copies not copies and here in the west there's like nothing still like no no Western Studio ever did like proper really can scale to Magic game it's six months from or seven months from we from our Magic episode and now in in China it's already like 20 games like doodle magic plus one they already passed the basic another like 10 more with the with the new iteration which is which I played on the on witch it's even like like this is going to be huge it's going to be huge already some some of the the games are in soft loue in like vest a little bit and making in soft lunch 30k per day just IP

so we're going to talk about it in the future don't worry yeah I was also going to hopefully be able to get one of our friends that we made in China which specializes in kind of talking about wi mini games to get research and all of the like yeah he he runs the the the group rankings and everything so he said yes so should be fine love it and on that note wow thank thank you China for having us it was an absolute pleasure I can't wait to go back yeah absolutely coming back uh thanks for all the insights and also the listeners thank you very much for coming and and kind of listening to this episode or watching it uh as well uh please join our slack Channel um also um I guess see you next time yeah by don't forget yeah don't forget to share the episode see you in this SL byebye byebye oh also subscribe on the YouTube subal message yeah c

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