two & a half gamers session #36 - Google AdROAS campaigns, Admon Exchanges, Survivor.io update

[Music] hello everyone this is no [ __ ] podcast to [ __ ] sake this is no [ __ ] podcast two and a half Gamers session number 36 we're sharing actionable insights dropping Knowledge from our day-to-day user acquisition game design and AD monetization jobs but also discussing the latest industry news from time to time while having so much fun so let's not forget this is 4:00 a.m. conference discussion Vibe so let's not take it too seriously today before I uh talk about our guests uh we have Google Adas campaigns reminder ad monetization educational segment from Felix and yakob is going to talk about survivor.io update so today we have Felix braer

yak and myself M again how are you long time no see hello there yeah super super long time no see right yeah yeah my favorite my two favorite friends from the industry uh and then it's it's you guys I'm blushing I'm blushing yeah well we're spending so much time with each other it's annoying from time to time right if we would not be having this we would be spending no time together if we don't have the even though we live in the same city that's very true but yeah like you know I don't want to spend time with you face to face this is enough this is enough so yeah what's up uh well you're going to covid Casa in the near future EO right yeah yeah we're doing the usual family gathering uh before the old Saints Day when the whole country pretty much gets on the road so we do it before and but it's like at the end of over

with yeah yeah but at the end of the month the whole country gets there so we want to kind of you know Skip the traffic right is All Saints Day a big thing in Slovakia it is it is yeah yes last year they wanted to cancel it because of Corona so everybody would get Corona so yeah and also like they said that no well you shouldn't be gathering with your family from like Thursday to Monday so everybody left on Wednesday I love it yeah people are not permitted to leave their County between the counties yeah I you know like if you do it from Thursday everybody leaves on Tuesday it's crazy to remember like where we were a year ago like everything in like Berlin was shut down like I forget it so quickly but yeah last year sucked oh no it was amazing it was amazing exactly amazing I didn't even you know to have like meet people actually and also like don't didn't have to meet with the family as well

sometimes that's annoying as well now I have a kid so I have like more excuses no but she can you believe she can can can you believe is like she's almost one year old I mean it's time flies [ __ ] my life my life move on to our little topics maybe yeah maybe okay I can start I can start with the with the Google addas campaigns and I think we discussed it like millions of times before but if your game is monetized by ads reach out to your Google representative or ping me I can share guidelines about at Ross based Dr Ras campaigns so Google made that announcement a while ago I think it was middle of the like last year and originally these Ty these type of campaigns were meant for admob only but thanks to the peer pressure uh which is a pure speculation you can run these

Adas or ad based dras campaigns with other mediations thank God and it works like a charm so let's uh you know let's push your Google reps or your UA people to get it on ASAP so I wonder who's prompting this like that Google is opening up and letting like being more open when historically they've been like one of the most closed ecosystems with these type of things like with bidding on ad monetization side and now with this I know right I mean but it's amazing because this type of campaign works really really well and uh I'm bringing this up again because I had a conversation with my former colleagues in April about these type of campaigns so uh after four months of the pure you know bureaucracy [ __ ] in the bigger company they were able to launch the campaigns in August and uh thanks to some like Shenanigans with their Google Representatives they were able launch in

August and immediately these campaigns were performing the best of all campaigns they are running at the moment so even if you have like 5050 well if you have 5050 split inaps versus apps ads iips iips IP versus as sorry I can't I can't speak properly today uh then get get it live even if you have like 30% ads and 70% inaps it's still worth uh the try as we discussed in the last last sessions it's not going to be like a huge scale but even if you can get like couple of hundreds or maybe thousand a day out there uh it's yeah that that money can get back pretty quickly because this uh you know conversion window is shorter so you're basically optimizing or free or 7 day uh window which is preferred and this window should reflect enough time to capture 90% of this like conver conversions uh and conversion value that

is happening usually on the campaign level you need to wait two or three Cycles so basically two depends on what kind of window you have it's either six nine days or two weeks or three weeks um uh to fairly evaluate the campaign on the other hand like uh General higher data volume is required for TAS bidding so you know you need to get enough data to to be able to judge properly if you are getting um good or bad numbers I usually do um three days conversion window for ad campaigns and 7day conversion window for inaps uh Tas campaigns but with some recent experiments even seven days attribution window for Adas campaigns work really well so you have seven days for collecting the data and then the algorithm is going to optimize for uh for these these conversions and values so what you need to do is set real istic

the target so you know like if you want to achieve 100% in seven days it's not going to work most probably remember this is the T Target or Adas Target is basically a lever for the budget spent so uh always when you when you want to spend more or less or get more quality you think with this uh bidding so whatever you achieved yeah just one second fix whatever you achieved uh in terms of the RW for the like comparable campaigns this should be the starting point for the the Tas bit ideally you beat 10 or 20% lower go Felix so blond question T roas what does a t stand for Target targetas Target R why can't you say Ras then well because it's Target R it's a basically like value optimization or value optimized campaign I'm not sure Yak why you're laughing I'm not laughing I'm just you know listening laughing of course you

are like I'll be the first to say it I've never run a u campaign in my entire life well I I don't think yakob did either uh I did like the basic clicking setup just didn't P button you know his Target r no ah they don't laugh at me yeah there you go there you go so then um there's like some c campaign optimization and setup tips well I I don't want to say say tips because you're just going make fun of me again don't panic M Don't Panic not yet not yet not okay so if your campaign has almost no traffic which is what I mentioned just now check your Tas bit a high Ras Target could cause a longer initial ramp up period so if you I usually set lower Target R bit and take it from there uh to get at least like some level traffic so if you are aiming for 50% on day seven put 20 or 30% the into the campaign then uh you

can gradually increase the target r as the campaign stabilizes to you know to achieve better Roi of course take on like make only small incremental adjustments 10 to 20% uh to avoid like volatility of the campaign I usually do 20% each like well every other day and I do this like kind of like a hamburger approach uh I increase budget then I increase bit then I increase budget again then I increase bit so you know I I try to change this uh uh optimization um tactics and then in the between I add also new creatives so uh hamburger approach plus new creatives because new you know then like the optimization is working instead of the creative what you have creative level data so what do you mean like you said you're changing creatives in between no I add new creatives between add new

creatives add new creatives between yeah and even if I if I change the creatives I usually get rid of the ones that are not performing well or not getting any traffic so as soon as I add new creatives uh or replace the the under performing ones I see the performance okay right right away so that's uh that's like the the update on the otherise campaigns please start as soon as you can uh it's definitely interesting type of campaign and then there's one other thing which uh got a lot of attention on my blog and I wrote I quote nobody cares about tcpa so it's Target CPA even optimized campaigns anymore don't use proxy events or predictive purchase events it's [ __ ] it's good on paper [ __ ] in reality so I getting a so actually somebody somebody reads my blog that's amazing thank you very much for doing that uh I got into a lot of troubles with writing these things but there is the the one that I mentioned before in

the newsletter as well which is the proxy events so when you're trying the proxy events uh it makes sense on the paper but in reality it's it's kind of works differently because of the algorithms on the proxy events for you Felix especially what does it mean uh so you have purchased let's have a segment called the blonde question segments yeah let's do it so you have you have purchased and then you have some uh events that happened before uh that led to actually purchase so for example players that achieved level 45 and then had 50 matches on the PVP side made a purchase so then the you know the hypothesis is if you optimize for level 45 or whatever I mentioned those players will also make purchase afterwards but will be cheaper because nobody optimizes for these type of events but how the algorithm works if you optimize for uh level 45 you will will get players that

achieve or trigger level 45 but don't necessarily pay afterwards because it's a different type of uh of players so I mean it's definitely worth a test it's a good exercise so you know like it's not you are not relying on on something that I said on the podcast but you actually get some data to back uh this opinion but what I think is more important it's it's worth trying uh even more is uh merging this event which means you merge proxy plus purchase into one event so people usually do this with like subscription apps they merge free trial with some other inup event for example you know I wrote wrot wrote an article on day one if it's app that you know um helps you with writing articles so when a player finish this proxy event and make purchase you know we will fire this event and let's let's call this this event mate so then you will optimize for mate event which combines both values which gives algorithms

better signals um that's something you can try or there is one one other thing which is in Firebase uh not sure if it's in beta or it's out live yet and it's called predictive events and you can also optimize for these events in fire in in Google ads so you can try that as as a like alternative to proxy events and you will see it's not work it's not working at all remot do you have get a feeling that like UA is like the bad boy component of our industry you know like they have all these cool words like proxy event T roas hamburger bidding model hamburger B that's that's what I called it's just that I don't think so like I have also a lot of fancy new words that I just don't use because Mr Design Vector is allergic to them no no no use it come on use it it's fine I will learn something new I'm not allergic always Keen to learn new things so please bring bring more vectors and design [ __ ] into

discussion I just have a have a question right so from my understanding these ad RS campaigns right you're optimizing to buy users that pay back just by looking at ads right so they're not supposed to buy IPS well they're not supposed to but they they usually do that as well oh okay so just typically like I'm assuming it's mostly rewarded video like games that you work with right like how many Impressions usually is like the sweet spot where you see these campaigns actually like scaling up quite a lot it's not about the Impressions uh on the I mean like more impressions mean more money right sure okay sure sure sure sure but I usually look at the split between uh the inaps versus ads I'm not looking at the The Impressions okay so let's see anything from 30% and above in terms of the split can scale 50/50 is the ideal scenario there are not many games like that I know but I you know I have uh like his luxury of working with a couple

of them but you know like you can you can do crazy [ __ ] with 20 30% uh ads as well it's fine yeah it depends also on you know absolute values if you're 20 30% means few Millions then we're talking something pretty big sure of course if 20 30% is $200 then doesn't matter that's that's the thing I keep saying it guys and you guys won't listen ads are the most beautiful thing ever it's it's definitely ni nice I'm I'm fine with it let's go that way should we go onto the admon topic or do we want to go stra thing in the world so yeah yeah the most beautiful thing in the world all right so stop shaking your head what the [ __ ] not shaking my head come here Remo let's continue come here yeah it's you should have the happy October as we discussed yeah exactly what's happy October so I think I think my educational segment is going to is

going to cheer you up Remo because it finishes with a lol and you know LS always make you smile so today I want to talk about exchanges and their growing role in mobile ad monetization and in particular how you can use them to increase your ad revenue on the lower end of your ad stack so if you're listening to this and you're currently mediating with Max or iron Source I'm sure that you've seen seen appleing exchange or iron Source Exchange in your stack why am I sure you've seen this it's because it's forced on by the mediation platforms and they switch it on automatically when you add an app so like you physically can't switch off these exchanges without the help of an account manager which takes more than a smile so you might also have noticed that Alx app loving exchange or iron Source exchange typically fill like somewhere in between the1 to $10 ecpm

range and the interesting thing is these exchanges are typically never in your top three ad partners by share or Revenue but by Impressions they're typically one or the third or like the second biggest by impression so if you don't know these exchanges are actually just amalgamations of a group of dsps so iron Source exchange has 49 dsps that they work with Alx I'm not sure uh but is around that number if not even higher and the interesting thing that I've noticed is that after the main like mediation platforms uh started to make their own exchanges mandatory it has really presented a nice new Avenue for us Publishers uh Publishers to force competition and earn even more ad Revenue so when you're optimizing your waterfalls or ad revenue or whatever you want to call it you're always kind of optimizing on two levels the micro and

the macro so the micro is like the normal boring moving around placements like up down you know changing ad mob calls up and down in different GEOS and then optimizing on the macro level is pretty much de like matching demand sources that are similar to compete so they push up uh your ad Revenue uh typical here what I mean is that you're like matching let's say applovin versus admob versus Iron Source you integrate those Network and you have them compete because they have similar type of inventory so since these exchanges are now forced on like both iron source and app Loven uh and they have been close like forced for close to like a year like I think app loving exchanges mopb exchange after they bought it so this means that you now as a publisher have now kind of been forced to add a new source to kind of compete against these new sources uh basically on your low value inventory and this has benefited

one player uniquely in our industry and that's DT exchange so like DT exchange is also an amalgamation of like DSP inventory and DS like DT exchange has been rebranded and it used to be fiber so fiber had a like as we know had a couple of Rocky years like three or four years ago uh but now since the mediations are forcing their own exchanges on those public Publishers they've like suddenly like overnight become very very relevant again so uh if you think of your like waterfall in Iron sourcer Max you have like the premium networks competing for the top and the mid parts of the waterfall and then the exchange takes up always the bottom part of the waterfall so if you're not adding a competing partner to compete either with Alx or iron Source exchange like you're kind of losing out on a lot of portion of a lot of your impression because like that portion of the waterfall is just

unchallenged so I've seen it happen and I've added like a digital turbine on both of these like mediations and I typically see my lowquality inventory jump like in terms of the revenue I'm getting for it by like anywhere between 12 to 20% by adding another exchange here so Remo here comes a little lull moment for you so here C up buttercup okay so I dug a little deeper here and a funny little Cor popped up uh I looked in the last days on the earnings by DSP so basically I looked into the inventory that I'm getting from Alx iron Source exchange and I compared it to the inventory I'm getting from DT exchange see here if you two notice something funny so keep in mind that Alx never competes with iron Source exchange but basically they compete with digital turbine right so Alx last 30 days top five dsps DSP number one Maloo two

liftoff Three Twitter four chart boost five bigab bid iron Source exchange Maloo liftoff bite dance trade desk and chart boost here comes the funny part DT exchange top five dsps Maloo lift off trade desk Opera and chart boost all same all over again yeah so pretty much you're getting dsps competing against themselves to bid up the price it's beautiful so like these are bidding against themselves when you add another exchange to compete like of course salespeople from these organizations will deny it till they die but it's 100% happening like there's like definitely same campaigns that are going in because it's the same games right to what degree they're bidding against themselves I don't know do I care no not really it's not my problem it's for them to kind of figure out but so the new top tip if you're

mediating with app loving or iron Source you have no choice anymore you need to find a competition like competition for their exchanges and right now there's pretty much only one like one vendor that can scratch that itch there might be one kind of new one coming as well now with Amazon and they have a DSP kind of component called Tam but it's still like enclosed beta so it's not open yet so that's my adamon top tip from this week so where's the tip add a competing exchange to like you need to add DT exchange basically you have no choice but are we talking only about the lower half of the waterfall yeah no the lowest third like lowest thir low now we now we now we even half okay so what's what's the expected amount of like revenue from this lowest third is it like it adds up right so like of course the revenue from this portion of the waterfall is the lowest in terms of

Revenue right but it's the most in terms of Impressions so it will bring up your average considerably if you improve it right because it's the largest portion of what you're getting paid right so let's say your lower part of the waterfall or your exchange average value might be filling at $4 maybe if you add a competing exchange against that it will push it up to six and you know that money every day hard to get the the new exchange into the waterfall need to add the and that's it and set up the ad placements based on your implementation team yes yeah so it's it's not that easy yeah it's not that easy yeah this guy always smiles at everything but then you have to go and beg programmers to actually do it exactly of I can't do it I don't know how to program I don't even know how to do UA I can't program yeah it's easy you know you just add the new adapter and then you go to your programmers and they like wo one line of cod come on yeah yeah exactly yeah that's what I always say how hard can it

be yeah one line of code oh everybody can do it in five minutes for sure yeah exactly getting [ __ ] about adding a line of code you you then add the line of code and the whole game breaks yeah you exactly like you one line of code and they're like Community Management QA everything is [ __ ] everything is blam people are complaining on the Discord blah blah blah and then okay so look so how much money do we you know add up to this uh well Felix said you can you can improve like by 12 or 20% do we care yeah exactly course care of course you should care of course you should care if you compare the resources that you need to put into this and then potential risks that you know it's going to break the game then it's like it's not worth it's not worth it what man you are just playing with the lever somebody needs to actually create them yeah yeah exactly there you go guys have no idea what I'm

talking about of course we know we've been there been there many times yeah yeah well you know I mean I wouldn't listen to the Mr skeptic over there hugging the mic again but uh it's it's actually true if you know if if you can't improve the numbers uh heavily then you know some programmers in big companies say like well we don't care the thing is even if this improves let's say say your Revenue by $100 a day which is not a far stretch to like if you're earning you know 1,500 a day in ads right and you add this and improves it by $100 a day that's still you know $36,500 a year right so you know in terms of De resources it needs maximum half a day right break if that breaks the the game uh then you you run that risk anyway when you're running ads anyway you always run that risk and like it's not like their SDK is more shy than the rest of them I mean all the sdks are let me just ask you this question do you think that the more sdks and

these things you have there the bigger the chance that something goes wrong do you agree but you need like okay maybe you should take out maybe we should take out all the maybe you should just make a Unity direct deal and just have only Unity how about that amazing programmers would take that immediately Edo te number two yeah H yeah how to ruin your ad Revenue thought you were smiling but you know you need down others makes him happy yeah I see that happy October all right let's go on to your topic are we going to the educational one from product side let me fire up here the survivors thing because um yeah as we said and we used to say a lot of times we will kind of see and observe and see what happens so we did observe and let's recap the observation that that happened uh I guess you guys didn't fire up the game for last three weeks anyway of

course of course not of course not durian you can get durian as a weapon uh no there's there's other things uh but just want to mention because last time we were talking about uh extending uh progressions how to manage game during liveops and after global launch and like if anybody will return to that episode one one thing did they add any design vectors into the game of course amazing please continue in that case this is highly relevant This is highly relevant for everybody yeah because the things that weal about that in that episode they did exactly that and I'm I'm guessing like they're listening they're listening thank you very much guys oh I mean look that the the the survivor.io uh Global launch Cas is the you know most downloaded and played episode on our podcast to to this day

the most wrong on so it was great yeah it's great yeah yeah uh yeah anyway props to team at hubby prop to us of course yeah props to us also but the thing is that it it it went pretty much as I expected so let's start with like the biggest things that they added um of course they added the new layer of power on player progression meaning that the inventory of the player was pretty much doubled so not only now you have the six six item inventory that you had before now you had another six item which are Tech Parts which work very similarly to the previous thing uh again I should update the game and play it again no [ __ ] so you have three defensive and three offensive slots there again six slots uh the equipment can be again merged through the usual merging process and you know it gives you more stats uh and also some kind of abilities I that complement the current weapons I guess this was the biggest kind of a flavor

thing that was the hardest to do because they I guess they added a little bit of new functionality even though it's still parametric parametric meaning that uh you are going through a pool of parameters that are affecting the current things in the game so it doesn't record that much new functionality but it's still you know somebody needs to code that whatever your Dorian can now split into six or something because that that needs like new functionality but in the end uh player power is now splitted as I said like they pretty much added much more player power into it and how do you get these Tech parts of course from the new game mode that we predicted will happen which is called the daily challenge uh which is for now as I seen the only source of these you can get them in the carousel at the shop but I haven't seen a chest yet or an offer that pop up to my face so it seems this is kind of a like a progression exclusive yet to get these parts yeah not yet they will they will pop this into your face during Halloween event

yeah probably anytime soon so there's this new mode um again it's very very recycled content it's pretty much just a normal like seems like a normal run but what's there is that there are modifiers based on this mode that uh Change Daily so let's say currently in the game there's like player movement speed increases by 40% uh mobs don't Flinch I guess they get they can go backwards or something if they're scared or whatever so pretty much what happens you have this kind of flavor mechanic that again is parametric because you're rotating a set of parameters the things that already been using to the game and this is the only source of the parts which means you are using again energy and this time it not only cost per one run five energy but 10 energy so it's double than that so currently uh what we did is we extended the possible kind of a horizontal content of the game let's say horizontal content yeah because it's

the same it's the same if it would be vertical that would be like different things happening So currently you know you just took the normal game State the core gam playay and put it in a different context so it's horizontal and still the progression kind of increased because what happened before was that people would be stucked at the current uh main suburb or whatever was that the level they are in and that's it yeah that's that's what happened to me and then I yeah exactly so uh now you not only get stuck here but you can also get stuck on daily challenge or amazing well done yeah so but but there's more content uh good good thing is that uh it's granular reward meaning that if you just defeat one boss at daily challenge you already get the reward because there are these three chests that you can get each for one boss if you just blow through it all you get all three at once that's still like the problem probably I would say this is a validation to the thesis that we had that the game's like

one session or like one run is just too long that's why probably they give the Gran rewards now because it can get very long and if you die at the last boss is literally like 15 to 20 minutes wasted so this this way they can at least give you something which is I guess validates the thing that the game needs to kind of play a little bit with their sessioning uh the other thing that they added is of course the returner event I'm guessing which is that if you log in after sometime the game starts like your specific 7day login event and also Daily rewards which I have now two daily rewards basically I have the normal AFK Arena ones that are the dailies and weeklys with like increasing points chests and I I have done like a normal like another daily rewards which are if I understand correctly they unlocked throughout the day and for 7 days so I'm guessing these are triggered only when you didn't play the game for some time and then the game wants to keep you in in a way that

they're showering you with resources and extra resources so I'm guessing if you two guys actually like move your lazy ass to the game you will get both of these yeah I will yeah I will tell you I will tell you exactly um other than that uh when I was going through the patch notes uh it seems that they added some new kind of a perks or you know the skills the thing that you can check during the leveling process but yeah didn't find anything that's kind of like super different or something like that uh the other interesting thing is that also they run this typical very cheap and easy Todo template of an event where you put an event currency into the game during a specific period of time and then you run an event jop so it was called Autumn Leaves in uh September and by playing the game you would get these kind of a you know event currency Autumn Leaves and you can buy stuff from the event shop and afterwards uh it would vanish away so pretty much again they did is again nothing new it's just kind

of a UI capacity here where you add more rewards into the game during period of time pretty much trading your economy for engagement again that that's okay that's what I want to ask like what would they achieve with this yeah that that similar Playbook how are the metrics looking now after they Chang this yeah I'll get to it uh last thing that I want to mention is that the special offer or not specialer like the special chest they had there with the S s+ Equipment that they they extended of course they extended again no good good old trick with the time limited box yeah exactly because of the overwhelming player feedback we extended again until end of October so because yeah we like money and it's it's the most powerful uh Revenue driver for for us so yeah let's it yeah let's see okay but uh other than that I didn't see that much changes in the shop rather than just the like new parts power player uh token being added into the carousel so

that's there and regarding the metrics uh the game is still going super strong I would say it's still averaging something like uh one and a half million in spikes and then going to something like 1.3 million or just in iips so it's of course much more EDS are very strong now a day right yeah a day a day a day a day uh the interesting thing when I was digging through the charts that I found out is that we finally got our first uh retention uh score for August and it doesn't look that good than archero because when I was looking at the comparison both games have around 40% day one but at day seven they go their separate ways because archero is something like 15% and Survivor IO is at 10% and at day 30 archero is 9% and survivor. iio is is at 3% do you think that's because they do too long like the

15minute like typical battle is a bit too long M I guess there are there could be many culprits here one of them being that the game is much more repetitive than archero but also much less harder even I would say because at some point you just know and like I didn't get stuck that fast in like in Archer you get stuck immediately yeah we remember during the first days like everybody was just kind of Rage quitting so currently the game is much more let's say smooth in the beginning the other thing is that I would say it's much more condensed fun than archero where you kind of need to you know you need to get the fun and like get to it here it's pretty much like in in archero you're getting pieces of cake one by one slowly with this kind of P yeah this is fun riding your face yeah this is like eat the whole cake in the first second you open it yeah and and I guess maybe there's this kind of a burnout a little bit but for me the biggest problem is that the

VAR the variety is not there any way that the session is still like one run is still too long for instance the daily challenge that they did maybe I would do it kind of a u less less of a time uh capacity so let's say Five Minute one could be good or something like that like they have something similar with the daily event and the the gold mine there but yeah the sessioning definitely would need some kind of a more let's say mid tier uh mode that you can spend your like a smaller section of time basically and the other thing is that yeah I just want more variability because it's pretty much the same thing all over again even the enemies I think could kind of take more work but these again are the biggest things to code in because you need to code like new functionality test it out like you know put it into context and balance it around all the other enemies in the game and stuff y y y so adding like new enemy properties and new enemy attributes I guess is like really hard it's it's completely different like what they did here with the uh the tech Parts which

increased the inventory size pretty much they double it because you know those are just stats in Excel sheet and the only thing like coded there were the functionality of the parts that they of course complement the gear so but yeah I wouldn't be surprised if we were not seeing the the correct data on the like the data tools that we like still pretty early yeah yeah the other interesting sorry just finishing the metrics the other interesting part is that archero is much more uh let's say the revenue of archero comes much more from us than the survivor.io where survivor.io pretty much goes from Taiwan China South Korea and only on four places us yeah yeah well I would be definitely keen on seeing like the China metric as well that would be super interesting that would be really good yeah like like China full metrics full metric of course yeah 100% so so if these retention

metrics are right which they might not be right um like I mean they're decent but they're not like knock it out of the park right so probably what they do so well which is why they have scaled is they're super good at converting payers yeah and squeezing the pliers from from the beginning yeah exactly immediately because if you have this type of like day30 retention I mean you can't even even day seven 10% is kind of subar yeah you can't optimize well you can but it's really hard to optimize campaigns more than like the to get like day 30 Roi positivity from the campaigns I mean nobody stays in the game after day 30 so I need to really look into into the short term which may like make sense from the ads perspective on the other hand so yeah they they seven 10% doesn't S I was thinking about it isn't this caused by you know the game being kind of hyper casual and the virality factor and everything that it can attracts like

like is literally getting like half a million downloads a day yeah for for like a something like that's closer to midcore isn't this the problem that like they just have like so low CPI that like a lot of people leave anyway so if you would just take let's say the people after level 10 the retention would spike to like really really good yeah of course yeah yeah for sure yeah 100% uh but it's I mean we will never know yeah it doesn't matter in the end what's the retention if money exactly if they make 1.5 million a day nobody cares game from machine Zone had like 14% day one nobody car yeah yeah yeah exactly exactly and I think with that in mind uh yeah that's it for today right perfect let's keep it short yeah short and sweet fun engaging and uh insightful as well yeah go play Survivor IO don't be lazy yeah we'll do we'll do and also uh we will play and you you guys subscribe on YouTube Spotify and apple because we

want to see Felix in bra laava in the near future all right thank you guys bye see you later bye-bye see [Music]