Exploring Alternatives: Mobile Gaming’s Megatrend for 2025

[Music] hello world welcome to the pocketgamer.biz podcast I'm your host Peggy and saltz and we are back the team is back from PGC Helsinki and I'm off to roia con very shortly and looking for a lineup of speakers people to bring back here and join us on the podcast soon but in the meantime I'm also taking the opportunity to look back on some of the events I have attended starting in this episode with games Forum Hamburg and uh Hot Topics there they are the Hot Topics that really truly Define the rest of this year going into 25 Innovation diversification alternative channels distribution all of this comes together

and of course gaming developers are listening because they are ripe and ready for an Innovative alternative app distribution channel that goes beyond traditional app stores and players well players are ready as well because they are frustrated trying to find cool apps that they love which brings me to a thought grenade from digital turbine drawn from their recent survey that just underlines how much of a paino discoverability is lack of it rather is and will continue to be because nearly 70% of users say they would use new discoverability features if they had them of course and This spells the opportunity for Studios to generate more revenues if they actively take advantage of Alternatives so there's no mistaking it Alternatives is the mobile gaming Mega Trend we're going to hear lots more about it and that's probably why against this

backdrop that's probably why we're hearing that digital turbine is also looking towards what they are calling an all alternative future that's capital a capital l capital L all what does that mean well it what it means it says on the tin it means everyone All Digital turbine is looking to democratize the app ecosystem opening up for players and particularly for developers and of course no matter the approach it all boils down to one thing finding Alternatives that not only deliver better economics but also better growth so with that in mind at games Forum I caught up with a few marketers and a couple of growth gurus as well to weigh in on what they prioritize when considering Alternatives when looking at the mobile gaming Mega Trends ahead so let's get started

we are here games forum and Pocket Gamer at the same time and I've got Tobias Adel he is director of marketing wow games wow right um so we're talking all the time about Alternatives so I'd like to get your take on a couple of Alternatives just just stream of Consciousness here when I say alternative app stores what do you think of um I'm completely with you so alternative app stores is really a important Source um especially what's what's out on the market already so with wow games we are on certain stores like Samsung like Amazon app store and uh it's a good potential of of of of getting additional users absolutely because it's all about more is better right so we'll take it from there alternative distribution channels now that's something a little bit different that's Discovery what's your first impression when I say that um also something that we already do so um for

us as we have a product which is crossplatform so we not only cover app stores we also cover web um so for for my window regarding user acis is really wide uh because I'm also able to go the alternative way back to web and get users there to our product and uh then scale them up even from web to mobile and then the other way around and and there I can collaborate with with TV stations I can collaborate with uh uh websites again like news portals and uh there we have strong strong Partnerships over many many years and back then it was the major source but now I will call them alternative sources and and ways of UA so a little bit full circle little bit ahead of your time as well tibus which is what I would personally expect from you what about alternative Discovery Channels you know the preloads the on device opportunities out there how do you judge them or have you already judged them it really

depends on the partner and uh at the end how it's integrated with the manufacturers at the end or with the network providers like DOA Telecom or um T-Mobile in the US so there there are some differences and this is something that you really need to explore what's the best fit for you um but it can be good but I also have to say um some sources can really fail so but this is something that you really need to explore but it is all about more is better what are you looking at what has you most excited over at Wild games um at the end my main focus is Roi so on a certain point I want my money back on a long term so this is my my main focus and um at the end uh it needs to be the healthy mix so I ever if I do some kind of use acquisition I will not put it on one card so for me it's like a some kind of old school marketing mix and there you to have to put in and all kind of of of

sources so and this needs to be in in a healthy way yeah so and um if it's possible to scale like hell uh for sure I will do this but it it needs to be healthier because it can turn out that in one month the partner is perfect and you have like good quality but I also got the experience that on the second month the quality is so bad and then I really need to to switch it off and this is something where we really have put your eyes on that that the the uh partner is uh yeah and the right performance um speaking of performance looking at the high performance of ads is also about the creatives and it's a question right you want to get your money back I totally get that but then big discussion about how far do you go for that so let's have you weigh in a bit so nobody does fake ads but everybody's telling me it's part of life which is true yeah so but actually I will not call them really fake ads so it's like yeah put a back package around

it and then develop the users on the long term uh and uh it's yeah it's something that you also need to check and and and what's the best value at the end and and and how your users react at the at the end so how you can track them how you can measure your numbers and then and it's a yeah try and error thing yeah so but but for sure we also creating ads which are not 100% the product um but it's close by so we we try to sell an impression of of of what you can expect at the product but let's say in a different way like the package around yes so looking of the packaging and and and then sell on the long term what's inside the last word here is also to look at the numbers and to look at what you measure and how you measure it and that brings me to the last point about the AI and

creatives um it's all about making as much as you can testing as much as you can but we did also hear a couple interesting insights about what happens when you set it and forget it and it doesn't necessarily drop off a cliff what does that make you think of so it's it's really important that everything that you test you do it proper and also on the long term so the thing is that at the end I also looking into Campaign which we did like two years ago and I always uh check them and then it's like okay maybe the performance in the first case was not that good but then I see on the long term uh the user are turned out and be be be yeah a valuable user so this is quite important that you're always even keep an eye longterm on your campaigns and and and check them and you're one of the very few who tries to bridge between product and marketing and some of the refereeing maybe in the battles between the two in a nutshell

how do you turn that LoveHate relationship into one of that Sparks Joy um yes it's it I always call it like like a a proper educated marriage on a long term so you have your up and downs between the product and marketing and the thing is at the end the marketing is with nothing without the product and the product is nothing without the marketing so we need each other it's some kind of love and hate and we try to or we inter our product guys into into marketing topics and have a have a close exchange and and and and it's really important to to share from both th sides what you're expecting what what what what you want and and and if you build up this relation as I mention yeah mhm like an good marriage be a good couple with up and downs but at the end each other it it's deep love some people are saying no just change the model at the studios and make everybody an

owner and an owner of the experience but also benefit from the results in other words give me a cut and I will suddenly not be maybe so particular about product and I'll actually let in a few more ads and a few more abhs so it's basically rev shares what do you say to that I'm a friend of rev share okay um but more on the marketing side where you are yeah so uh with with the partners so with ref sh is is is a model that we are running with Partners but not inside the product so I think exchange is is is important but uh experts should be experts in their sector but at the end I think marketing people should do marketing stuff and product people take care of of of product stuff and then uh yeah should work good together and close absolutely and in that segue talking about marketers experts working well together to be as always always a way to talk to

you thanks so much thank you very [Music] much so if somebody knows about Performance Marketing you're one of them Ryan I have to ask you what is your first impression what comes to mind when you think about alternative app stores alternative distribution yeah interesting um so I think I think of something that's Gathering storm like you know it definitely I I would say that I've historically been someone that wasn't too impressed by the possibilities that were out there but you can't deny that just government policies across the world now are moving towards a direction of anti anti monopolization and therefore you've got Apple and Google having to take notice especially in the EU right yes and so now companies like epic are starting to make like actual very serious noises about setting up different app stores so I'm not you know basically I'm still not

convinced by what is currently out there at least in like Western markets while well I don't think there's like lots of option right now I think it feels like I said it's a bit of a gathering storm I think things are going to be changing and I think it's because legislation is pushing pushing the industry that way are you looking at it and saying yes I'm in on this and if so what is exciting there for you um I would say we're definitely not writing it right now okay checking it out yeah I guess kind of yeah well keeping an eye basically on on on what really pops up and what really happens you know like if you know it sounds like epic are going to be doing their game Focus store um potentially across both platforms and that obviously would be something well worth trying and getting there early like uh you we have a PC console part of our business and you know epic and being early with Epic on the PC console side definitely benefited a lot of companies not necessarily Epic ironically um but uh you know so you

could see how there might be some advantages there of getting early ahead of the ahead of the curve but um yeah otherwise otherwise it's more just keeping an eye testing some of the obvious ones like Amazon and the other alternative distribution channels I mean there's still preload there's lock screen there are a lot of ways to get in front of people um yeah so I guess in terms of actually getting users to see your games it I think it depends what kind of games you're running right okay so for us it's actually a bit of a transition period at the moment I guess like a lot of companies we've we've gone from heavily ad monetized to hyper casual sort of hyper casual hybrid casual casual yeah and you know like over the last month we've started running like fairly serious UA on on our first like big casual title that is very fair chunk I AP oriented so for us naturally it's a time to start looking at like you said like other distribution channels that

are away from the kind of normal social or SDK Network for the first time we're looking at yeah preload and um offs and things like this very seriously and I think it's because of that slightly like higher iip Focus so you know there's probably a few companies like ours that are starting to dive into that world you've got your eye on the prize Ryan which is what I would expect from you so hey thanks cool now let's take it to another level and talk about alternative distribution channels that means different ways of getting your game in front of a different new audience all sorts of cool ways of doing this what comes to mind for you you know as a chief Communications officer I usually work with content creation and for me acquiring new users usually connected to new distribution channels in terms of communications like social media platforms like um I don't know like user generated content

which gives which goes viral and gives you more players as we have really different segments of our target audience you never know when you can meet your next user so yeah for sure and the world is changing the industry is changing and we definitely need to pay more attention to New Opportunities so best I know it's an no-brainer it's an no-brainer it's a winner thank you so much thank [Music] you o i are and you are u a lead at Voodoo so you know all about interesting channels new approaches a couple hacks maybe as well tell me what you think what comes into your mind when I say the words alternative app store uh alternative app store uh what I can what pops into my head is exola

really which is not exactly an alternative app store distribution but uh alternative um monetization Channel I guess I mean merch merch counts yeah merch counts it's a it's a web shop okay now alternative distribution alternative distribution channels how about your gut feeling how excited emotionally is this like yes this is the next wave this is I had someone just recently who said yes that is where a storm is brewing so fairly dramatic how dramatic are you going to get about this we're operating in a in a business where um there is um a lot of investment is going on there are a lot of uh players uh in this Channel and almost all of those players and almost all of that money and investment uh is always looking for the best thing uh so if there is an actual uh alternative distribution Channel or alternative Network work or or whatever it is it's

not going to be alternative for long it's it's not it's not going to take long for that to become um mainstream okay so so the channels are good it's just maybe the alternative is a misnomer it's just like new and not yet saturated channels is what we need to be saying and that's maybe where the where the money is uh yeah that uh that's that that could always be correct uh you can you can tell me off camera what those are we don't know we don't have to alert anybody else no no then they won't stay they won't stay hacks anymore okay Oz you shared I appreciate thanks so much yes [Music] anytime M you have an opinion on everything so yeah indeed you do so I have to ask you what's the first thing that comes into your mind when I say alternative app stores o alternative app stores I would say Samsung or who away

actually because I ran like few few campaigns back in the days on on Samsung store which is not really scalable but it's still an interesting uh kind of UA Avenue also Amazon but it's not really alternative uper okay so it has a place has a place in the strategy yeah it's not again not scalable but still well we're all looking for Alternatives that's the whole point alternative distribution channels other ways to get your games in front of people whether it's preload or on screen or just trying to find new ways to discover games getting that game in front of new audiences what's your play what's your take on that my take on that I would say I used this like Amazon WG screen campaigns M which is an interesting uh alternative UA kind of tactic you have the videos or static images on the Amazon vake screen just you know try to read and there is an ad that's working

really well for Amazon devices and uh especially in us especially for female oriented games my Tre okay hack for getting discovered for getting discovered well hack Tik Tok at the moment okay organic like organic uh post on your um uh Tik Tok account that's it you're off to your meeting go off and uh and kick ass thank you this show is all about how to do your job better how to make an amazing game how to Market it and you have a say so if you have a story or know someone we need to shine a light on then we would love to hear from you we want to hear from you we want to reflect the reality of the mobile games Market in all its wonderful complexity and strangeness so if you have any suggestions for us if you have any feedback for us you can always get in touch you can email us at at pocketgamer.biz you can find us on

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