Frank Pearce Leaves Blizzard | Games ReCAP Episode 025

[Music] this one comes from actual game developers we're gonna take the big news from yesterday we're gonna or over the weekend since it's a Monday and we're gonna find out what story was the juiciest that we can dig our teeth into and you know just expand the pun for a while yes if you are watching this on our twitch TV forward slash blue underscore chance chance thank you for watching if you are catching any of us early you're probably supporting us to our patreon.com for slash blue chance or becoming a twitch live subscriber twitch prime will come to us any day now so

anybody that says crest on that channel will be fantastic today because it's laundry day you can find that on our merch store over at blue chains as well okay that covers the basics alright so before we go into our next topic this is something we were talking about for a wild lizard co-founders leaving high departures high-level departures are happening what is going on there's like three or four G's that basically can just show the work and just exist some money I'm sure he has a ton of equity and everything as you Shoji that this person was there when the company was called silicon synapse yeah so slightly some reason listen it's

kind of over overview like for the people who who don't know anything about about what it means to you before we go into life I'll say Blizzard Entertainment and prior to them being Blizzard silicone synapse has been part of the gaming fabric for something like 28 maybe 28 29 27 years somewhere around there I think they definitely and I might be overshooting that because I think the first games I remember from them were PC and Super Nintendo PC stuff was like you know like obviously Warcraft for one that was the big one that I first got introduced to them but you know they had on lost vikings black throne actually played on Super Nintendo as well Rock n Roll racing it was another game that was synapse which eventually became Blizzard but you have a team of ragtag young hungry developers

starting their own company making software then someone had the great idea to you know kind of take war hammer and re-envision it as a PC game with their own story with their own lore and you have you know orcs versus humans and their derivative of like that type of fantasy was I mean the rest is history like that's that was their their footprint on the gaming fabric initially and then from that point on they just kept getting bigger and bigger and bigger bigger and bigger and bigger and it may be bitter but we are at a tipping point at least towards fans do you even have it was it the crest of when people were fearing that Activision's control was kind of overtaking places creativity yeah and so shortly after that a lot of departures along along the eSports arena for that division eight hundred people

laid off last year shortly beginning of the year a co-founder actually left as well right so this is a second company I guess and that's the telling thing to me right if I look at blizzards history as a company regardless of how we feel like they may or may not have been spending funds or developing projects or how they're handling the business end right we had never seen in such a small window many level or so many top-level executives essentially in Exodus leaving the company right even though it's Activision Blizzard now I still consider the people that I see leaving part of the Blizzard side and to say it was a blizzard issue I don't think you would see the frequency happening in such a small window right it definitely would have happened before the merger I'm assuming and so I guess me as an outsider I lead I lead this to believe like maybe there's just cultural differences or value differences and how activision wants the blizzard side of things to be running and that may not be working with a lot of these c-level

execs especially if you've spent - almost three decades you know kind of in one philosophy and then now being forced or mandated to like really start making these very tight very abrupt changes to how you do things being told that your way was wrong it was like that I can see why now it's like what Mike Morhaime is gone he's leaving you know you have more people leaving you have top-level people top man we're leaving the company and we keep seeing you know every six seven eight months like another name another name another name yeah it's a lot it's a lot for a company that's been around for like 25 years right so let's kind of look over this article and look at the details I mean I think it's pretty straightforward with Frank Pierce being one of three Co fast so there are three so it's you have less so far looks to be the last guy it's less than a year after President Michael

so the time has come for me to step away from Blizzard and pass the torch to the next Bobby Kotick of leaders quick question for you Brandon this is a chat comment says that your microphone makes you sound like a angry squirrel it's very tasty sure maybe that's my voice so yeah you're good over here on the switchboard thing okay I'll just ask him to let us know now yeah so why was why was bring up the cadence and why was bringing up the the window of you know why people might have been leaving for so so soon or so abruptly is it what I think the word I'm looking for is more like I guess the

description of the word is the coincidence is a lot harder to call a coincidence because of the frequency being so common they're in this very small window like we have no mass exodus for 27 years right Activision Blizzard merger being the main new thing that has happened and then now in this in this last two-year window we're seeing like 6-7 executives leaving you know what I mean so that's why I'm saying that coincidence it's harder to call a coincidence and it seems like it's more related to some sort of internal event yeah and so even with his departure because I read his words of like a passing on the torch to the new generation you know very chummy very back patting and supportive of what he's been able to do there and then the hope that the company can continue to move forward yeah of course that's how you're supposed to leave like you always want to wish wish well but is do you think that there's anything hidden there like why would you have I would imagine a smooth sailing job opportunity if you're like the og do you know what I mean

you're not they're not firing you you're not gonna lose your job you might get one of those creative creative manager internal like hogwash titles just to keep you around and make sure that you get a salary just out of respect a lot of companies actually still do those kinds of things so I don't know do you think there's anything hidden there in regards to him being like you know what eff this much my two other homies are gone we're gonna go start our own Netflix small game company together I mean essentially they're not having fun yeah no one stops showing up to their job because it's it's fun it's because it's not fun anymore these guys are well-established within the industry so they have reputation they definitely have money and so the only reasons for them to stick around this long for the last decade husband because creatively they're having an output that they feel like it's worth showing up for yeah so I would imagine the last few years hasn't been that way it creativity is being

threatened then yeah why am I here you know I'm sure it was probably hurtful to kind of see them having a layoff 800 people from their own company right I think when you build a company like that to such a high regard you have a certainty when it comes to maintaining that and it hurts to be known as the company that laid off so many people after the overall company lose it themselves now that you bring that up yeah if you go back to that record-setting year what games contributed to that if you if you were to separate the activision side from the blizzard side right and say like here are the games that blizzard brought to the table here are the games that activision brought to the table that contributed to a record year in sales who do you think did most of the

heavy lifting sorry so Bobby cotton goes on to say like a record-setting year all these buildings that we've made if you look at product for product the games that Activision brought to the table that year and then the games that Blizzard brought to the table that year as far as who did most of the heavy lifting to make that revenue where do you think that revenue side needle lands towards yeah I mean I'm sure and that's the side that cut 800 jobs yeah exactly that's uh I mean it's true like Blizzard didn't have a good year they throw this is this is the problem when you're looking at quarterly profits is because you're not looking at the often on year for games of game developers whether they're making games or not right Blizzard is all about long tail plan where there's a reason why they have like 8 mega franchises like people

wish to have that that many franchise to kind of pick and choose from there they are fine for the rest of the century to just keep jumping back and forth on those ranches they don't have to create a new IP ever right but they still do which is impressive so for them to have an off here after so many years of success and to kind of isolate that is of course unfair and say oh look at that it looks like the gravy train is done time to change everything and that's pretty much what everything and they're starting anew again and for Activision kind of think that this is this is gonna recapture the magic it's insane so that's gonna hurt if anything I could see the want to modernize Blizzard

products and also their fan base I can see that attempt but because of the prestige that that company has the amount of clout that they have built in the hearts of the game developer or the gamers that support their products do you mind just go ahead sorry to think about those people feeling alienated because it's like oh the new model is being ushered in they're not gonna continue to release patches or support for my model it's that kind of a feeling right where they're like I love Blizzard PC games this has been a part of my life since Warcraft 1 like I said I have Sally shears tattooed on my shoulder you know glittering lego old-school people still enjoying the products still enjoying Blizzard lore still enjoying Blizzard gameplay are gonna feel like all men loot box everything micro trans thing instant dopamine dump game mechanics everything nothing hard nothing earned nothing rewarded after you know vigorous challenges like the

things that used to be difficult are just gonna be made like gotcha mechanic so I can see like there would be like resentment towards the company shifting that way and all I think all Blizzard had to do was just really show like look no we care about everything we've done we care about everyone that we have but it is 2019 we do need to modernize our strategies there's a lot less of these 30 $60 titles being bought we have the data and there's a lot more of these $0.99 titles or free-to-play titles being engaged with we have the data if you want us to keep doing these games that you love we have to spread out how we make money you know so I could see why those would want to modernize but I think that there's a lot of people who thought they were being abandoned because the Diablo announcement was Diablo mobile and not yeah before yeah and it wasn't just so much I think it was the album oh I think it was the tone deafness that's why people said yeah at Blizzcon and even if they just came out with a logo saying is da before it would

have been a better outcome for them but to make that center stage to hype it up to a crowd of PC players it's disrespectful man and it's a double down to say that do you have fun I think that was just a huge missed I'm not gonna put that on the company shoulders I think that that individual just kind of that joke didn't land you know like it's he had a bad set but like yeah it's a change of guard is the end of an era the days where you know people can just make quality games and I think to say that they weren't trying to modernize I mean I feel with overwatch and all their hearthstone they were approaching it with with game design in mind where it makes sense instead of forcing it all right because over watching hearthstone

are brand new like they reflect game design based on that era not necessarily preconceived expectations of game design like for example if you made a significant change to Diablo or a significant change to Starcraft it's a much different I guess you have people who are already expecting verses in hearthstone and overwatch she didn't hey I guess at least that I have something interesting though to bring up and I'm thinking about it how do you feel about potentially because we are talking about evolving in staying modern this guy was the chief of technology right a CTO chief technology technological officer a chief technology officer so when he started in the role that leaves him as the predominant expert of tech we're talking floppy disks you know 46 is no 28 modems now and like hard drives ahead 800 megabytes and now we're talking you know like tech has come so far and so long over that period of time I wonder if there's just fatigue

on his part which is like man you know what in order for me to still maintain and be in this position I have to stay current so many things I feel like a lot of the tech guys are usually who found themselves in this position usually are really good with keeping up because it's a hobby for them to kind of play around with tech on their own free turn I do agree that you know there's a huge there's definite fatigue is attributed from is up for discussion I think essentially why he left is mostly because people once gone and once stained probably through contractual I wouldn't be surprised in a year from now

that that guy will be gone too because listen you know Activision are these guys all three part I wanted to leave at the same time to be honest and so the size but activators like hey let's let's space this out let's have this transitional leave so that it doesn't become like you know you blow up your company basically that you built from the ground up you don't want yeah they probably came from that angle so now they're peppering every six months so I believe the next six to eight months yeah you're a multimillionaire right Larry yeah you built this company 28 years ago yeah what's holding you back if - your friends are already gone it's like come on you're enjoying life and you're stuck here with like Activision telling you what to do telling you what to do telling you what

to do with your company I can feel that yeah you don't want to stay around sorry guys it's been fun but was 28 years let's imagine he was 30 when he started that's a long time in the game industry and I and we might be getting these dates wrong and I'm not don't count the math from when you know the first game came out but also consider there was development time before that but whatever the amount of time that the company Silicon synapse to Blizzard Entertainment to Activision Blizzard has been in existence you have these people who were there since since napkin sketches at Denny's yeah right that is a long that is a long time a lot of game developers quit after five years let alone making it 30 years yeah I mean the only time wait I mean a lot of those dream but you know they want to make their brand like the best ever they've achieved that in my opinion right and to keep that going and it's only the only show because it's been fun

it's been fun hanging out and enjoying the success that they built but recently in recent years they've weren't able to make the calls anymore people by this day they probably spend those months moping around like quietly telling their favorite employees I hate probably for job owed a terrible period for them it must be as founders you know I'm sorry you know I felt you guys got 800 people dude that is ginormous yeah that's like three companies worth of people and to be fair just in case we don't have the facts because I know this is a while back was the entire eight hundred people from Blizzard or was there it was across but a good portion we're talking about Amy and because they got rid of a lot of their marketing department like and

hearthstone you know there's a huge controversy right now because hearthstone is looking for Community Managers when they laid off Community Managers and there those guys are still looking for jobs so there's like hold feeder like and it's like I'm a mother for with special needs children my husband it's like there's a whole thread that's going on right now so it's really weird rewind and think about why what is the case looking for lower salary people in those situations or they just figure it out pay we do need people I will say it usually depends on whatever circumstance right so like there we have to acknowledge that different people get laid off for different reasons so company makes a big layoff in let's say

they hire like or they layoff community developers they layoff animators and you know lots of people let's say a couple months pass they're in a new quarter they did the layoff like December financial projections look a little different you know and now they're like okay so we still have that need for all those spots hiring back those same people the only thing I could think of as to why that might be a difficulty is maybe they feel like people might be disgruntled for like having to bite the bullet for four five six seven months on their own dime and then there's like welcome to the family and like the kool-aid doesn't work the second time you know right so yeah that's that's that's one thing I can think of it's true it's true like a lot of kind of just reshaping the company is just getting rid of the toxic people it's true like especially what new management comes in they have these interviews where they kind of talk about your problem it's really kind of suss out yeah yeah it's true yeah so like one

minute if you ever been at these game developers studios and there's you're going through a management change the process usually you're the new lead right comes in and like we're gonna schedule one-on-ones and we're gonna get down to the problem we're gonna fix this problem so I'm sure like the sentiment changes so they figured maybe when it comes to community matter whatever positions they laid off it's just like hey we just get it opportunity for people who haven't been affected by whatever the bad thing was they came sweeping through first time around they

probably don't come to work with a chip on their shoulder and it's it's sad to say these things but you know I'm sure that plays a factor we don't know this is all speculative but for them to fire this position and then rehire also could mean that you know they were just trying to look good for that quarter and be like hey let's get rid of all this money restart next next quarter fresh and we'll just hire but again it's disrespecting these people the expendability that I see a lot of the big studios kind of attaching to people yeah as if it's like a fax machine yeah like that's not a that's not a person designer that's that's a that's a tick on the next I wouldn't write that it's like hey we need to for this quarterly call you know we need to boost so let's just rid of these jobs that don't matter

as much because that's kind of that's I forgot who said it but during that whole 800 people layoffs they were it was probably through their presence like all these are non gain des as a way to kind of undermine soften the blow yeah they said they were remember the end of their marketing and and Community Managers exactly so the person to play into that type of thinking they probably did just lay out these people thinking that hey and probably get so much for cheaper studios as well the like that attitude of like you should be happy you should be thankful for X opportunity or to be able to and so if you're not gonna come here and let us take advantage of you we don't want to work with you I really wish it was still like mutual benefit like I can't tell you how much mutual benefit helps right it helps the industry it helps the

employee it helps the employer yeah I'm getting a hundred thousand dollars worth of work out of you guess what I'm giving you $100,000 you'll be so happy and I'll be so happy when that when that starts to skew that's when that's when things go awry I'm expecting 100 caves worth work and you're giving me 60 or you're expecting 100 caves worth of salary and you're getting 60 you know I mean it's that's when really that's when you start to see problems and if you keep thinking that like oh but there are so many people who just want to be part of this company we can just turn and eat through and spit out all these developers Hershey reputation hurts the talent pool hurts the industry first founders feelings I mean that's essentially there's so much going on last year we've gone from game developers dying the work at Blizzard to what's going on and see how that plays out so many of our friends are like that that I've clocked is like yeah man they were especially if you want to live in Orange County

they are the company in Orange County right but right now it's funny that Brian and Blizzard it's kind of going through similar thing well so what so much grabbing ass these are the megaliths yeah blizzard to me has always been that like man you know get your resume up and then go apply there so that you can have your like 15 year career kind of wane and come to its end like I was I always thought that as a game developer that was paid to make games by some sort of boss or some sort of employment entity that Blizzard was gonna be the place that I like had the twilight of my career last my senior to creative director years was gonna be there and I know there's a lot of people who felt the same way whoo look at Orange County

or who looking at Blizzard is like I'm going to go there and I'm gonna be there for 15 years and then probably call it quits I just had this whole plan cool and I'm feeling less and less of that kind of sentiment sadly and that's when I started noticing the shift myself or even seeing my friends who are like man you got that you got that gig like what before all the news came out that was my attitude and now I'm like oh more I'm left yeah he don't believe he isn't if he isn't drinking the kool-aid yeah serving the kool-aid something's gotta be yeah I'm sure all three co-founders wanted to leave at the same time but Activision is all speculative but if I'm one of three co-founders and we're friends and been friends for 30 years they probably do this did you mercifully

every eight months could you imagine being RIT's enough to like quit your job just on principle yeah and again I'll say there's a lot of people who doesn't matter how rich they are that they would or wouldn't quit their job on principle but I'm just I'm trying to make a joke that like they did what me too I'm out like that's right it's not just one person if you are involved in the game development scene you're Ben you've probably been seeing a lot of developers leaving wizard which is crazy because it's like a minefield out there to leave you somewhat pretty stable job in Orange County of all places to feel again is a huge risk especially with when do you jump out of a lifeboat exactly when the water safer yeah Larry and I both

because it's a great place for developers what they do perform while I'm here there one of the reasons why California especially our area of Southern California is such a hot spot for talent and if you look at the trickle-down economics of game development employee pools yeah then being such a big attractor regardless of somebody going there or leaving there right if someone comes in and moves and like worth of Lisbon then after eight years they're like okay I'm a senior and I'm leaving all of the surrounding Studios have access to better talent right now is there such a magnifying bringing people into the pitch so they really help game developers exam so of course like I want to see them succeed for economic reasons for health of my industry reasons but then also just selfish personal reasons I play more of their games and put more time and money into their games then one two or three companies combined that's why people are so outraged because a lot

of people do care about what's going on and hope everything is okay like people who are you know even Blizzard itself or like complaining about the backlash that they got yeah well it's like clearly that was an indicator of you not being in touch but you should be happy that you have so many fans who care about your product which they are right but they were selfishly like trying to push their own agenda where they're kind of ignoring everybody else oh wow okay Blizzcon of all places of course that is where they would get the most bad guys he's the most hardcore of course these people yes that is your first offense

mad about feedback because feedback is reflection of an investment of some kind all right like if someone if someone doesn't care about you they're not gonna take time to even complain yeah because what does it give them any good or benefit to help you get better yes right feedback is like men I want this to be better or like I have an opinion that I think will help or even if it's hate it's because they're invested at least in some way like something has touched them or affected them that they need to share juanzi now if I'm blizzard I would not complain that people even if it was hate like man this sucks that you did this to us right as long as it was constructively based and not like actual like kill people who made this decision way too far with the things they say but even if you're like man look this is f you for what you're doing in us like even if it was that level of vitriol you still have to like be a company and respect the fact that these

people are sharing with you how they feel about what you've done right because they don't owe you their money right it's like it's like a negotiation it's like hey I've got this do you want this and the person says yes or no right you they don't owe you the money they're not just because they've bought from me before it doesn't mean that they're tied to you doesn't mean that they're always gonna be in your pocket to just oh you can do no wrong yeah you know I mean you always have to respect the fact that the consumers can put their money elsewhere yes it's not like to adhere to every complaint this was overwhelmingly like what are you doing and most of the people that I talked to who are very invested in I asked him what was going what was the main issues like don't announce a pair like make it a back of the page kind of announcement but they made it the main announcer with Diablo which is again the tone deafness of the whole thing yeah which angered people say you don't get us you used to get us I'll say this

if I was I personally don't feel like it was bad to announce Diablo Mobile at Blizzcon I think that that's actually a great stage you have all these people who want to see Blizzard you guys are up to that's something that you're up to I also I think that it kind of on people who are expecting to hear like a big Diablo announcement because this is Blizzcon where you look further like this is like all the new glimpse of the new WoW expansion era what's happening with heroes of the storm 2.0 or what's you know what the future of world like Starcraft is going to be are they making that new MMO the weight of that being the biggest news for Diablo is a huge letdown it is like making something basically for the Chinese market I think having understanding that like people want to know the big diablo experience they should have came with more oh yeah

no one would have been that upset with that - well for them not to try to do is already forgiven the day one login server crash issues like all the bad stuff that happened with diablo people have long since forgiven people love the the followers that i see who are like diehard about diablo yeah love the content now i love being able to go excuse me through the game with new characters hardcore mode dying like i've got to start over like all the little things that i see people enjoying about diablo I still think make it a great game that could be updated once again that click that click click click click click hyper click play it works on mobile so I don't I don't hate Blizzard for even trying

that's the that is the best game in line for a mobile experience move your character and touch stuff yeah do this all day that's every mobile game let's see what you ever played more or less so I don't blame them for what they did I just think that the unraveling of what they were doing and that's why if you believe that we've been fearing for a long time it's happening I'm prophesizing the next eight months we're gonna hear about the third co-founder leaving there's one left I don't know what I mean like I think those guys are like original employees but I don't recall who the three founders were changes end of an era

next is rain right I have no idea what this looks like a play we look at the track does with their franchise has been unscathed that's about to change watch every year really they can turn overwatch into the ecology because obviously that's what they're doing I think the games the service model for overwatch I think it works really well slowly roll out new characters normal style but one two - because overwatch is so fan

supported so lore and character identifiable that to like make it to right like when you think we need to give a launch title it's usually like a song like alright cool we're getting 15 characters in there to start and then we're gonna like slowly unroll or expand I would really hate to see them like go back to that like are we here in our initial eight and we promise we'll get those other characters that you know and love back in the game what's there to look forward to like I'm not excited as much about the second coming of you know Hanzo versus the first coming up somebody new you a lot graphical updates mostly with sequels and overwatch has at timeless style it's like two fortress like I think I could load up to four just two right now and still enjoy be very hard to convince me that the sequel is just fun it's gonna be interesting to see I will say this I

think the gameplay and the visuals of over watched stand the test of time in my opinion I think that it's definitely one of those games that I can come back to 15 years from now and be like man it still holds up because what they offer is like they get to the essentials it's just fun it's frantic it's fast and it works I mean I will say this though selfishly if a world of warcraft 2 came out I'd be all over I would love to see oh wow a smaller more concise but huge visual upgrade gameplay upgrade version of world Warcraft I'm sorry man you know one would know where I was for about three years straight I'm sorry I'm just gonna go ahead and say that if there was a graphical like if there was a modern like a 2021 version of World of Warcraft yeah I promise you you will not I'm gone so thank you for joining us on Twitter

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